The 'John Lennon Book Club'

Originally Posted by Apple Scruff

Oscar Wilde was the Man.

the Man.

Like John, Oscar Wilde was born in October (albeit not the same year!). Some (of the many) favourite quotes by him:

"A work of art is the unique result of a unique temperament."

"A dreamer is one who can only find his way by moonlight, and his punishment is that he sees the dawn before the rest of the world."

"Always forgive your enemies - nothing annoys them so much."

Wonderful. I particularly adore his play 'An Ideal Husband'. Lord Goring may be the idlest man in London but he idles around with charm aplenty. In my opinion, the 1969 version starring Jeremy Brett (as Lord Goring nonetheless! *crush* ) is by far the best and most stylish adaptation.

Originally Posted by Nowhere Anne

the Man.

"Always forgive your enemies - nothing annoys them so much."[/i]

Unfortunately, I don't know much about Oscar Wilde ... but I love this quote

Snoopy

Originally Posted by Snoopy66

Unfortunately, I don't know much about Oscar Wilde ... but I love this quote

Snoopy

Oscar Wilde was an incredible writer of plays and books; absolutely, without question, the most brilliant wit of his time. I think you'd enjoy him profusely, Snoopy, if you even purchased something like this.

I found an article discussing a film about him and they refer to him as the 20th Century's first pop celebrity who "had perfect pitch, perfect touch. He had a musician’s sense of a sentence.”

He was incredible. Our own wildewoman is a major follower and thus her name. John probably got the other part of his wit that wasn't inbred or inherited from reading Wilde. They would have probably gotten along famously (or not) because they were, in my opinion, almost equally as intelligent, perceptive, and witty, with perfect sense of style.

And yes, they were both born in October.

i know this is about books john read...but does anyone have this or is it worth checking out..??



gk.

Originally Posted by Apple Scruff

Oscar Wilde was an incredible writer of plays and books; absolutely, without question, the most brilliant wit of his time. I think you'd enjoy him profusely, Snoopy, if you even purchased something like this.

I found an article discussing a film about him and they refer to him as the 20th Century's first pop celebrity who "had perfect pitch, perfect touch. He had a musician’s sense of a sentence.”

He was incredible. Our own wildewoman is a major follower and thus her name. John probably got the other part of his wit that wasn't inbred or inherited from reading Wilde. They would have probably gotten along famously (or not) because they were, in my opinion, almost equally as intelligent, perceptive, and witty, with perfect sense of style.

And yes, they were both born in October.

Thank's a lot for the links, Scruffie Especially the first one looks very interesting and I might buy it. I tend to mix up Oscar Wilde with Shakespeare , I find their biographies quite interesting, though I feel more attracted by the personality of Oscar Wilde. I'll give me a push and will learn about him

Snoopy

Originally Posted by wallrus59

i know this is about books john read...but does anyone have this or is it worth checking out..??



gk.

Me, me, me... I have it, wallrus59

... and yes, it's absolutely worth reading it I often use it to look something up, when I don't remember in which other book I should search for the information I'm looking for It's quite thick and complete for sure...

Snoopy

thanks snoopy. i want to get it and i want the book about john's songs too.

gk.

Originally Posted by Fly

I was listening to the Imagine album this past weekend (what a damn work of art) and I kept thinking about this book thread that I haven't posted in because I'm not as scholarly as some of you b*tches. Well, low and behold, Crippled Inside starts playing and I remember one of the few books I actually read on my book list in junior high. I think this may have been Oscar Wilde's only published novel, but don't ask me- direct any questions to wildewoman.

Anyway, what struck me in the lyrics of Crippled Inside (which I don't think was written with PAUL in mind at all- John had other people he thought about and I personally think he could have just been singing in general or even about his fine self) is that they run parallele to the underlying theme of this book. There's this dude who is obsessed with his physical appearance, but he's a nasty @**hole and the mirror starts showing his decaying soul/inner person.

And the lyrics in Crippled Inside are:

"You can shine your shoes and wear a suit
You can comb your hair and look quite cute
You can hide your face behind a smile
One thing you can't hide
Is when you're crippled inside"

So I really think that John may have read this book and got the dark, deep theme of it. And he thought about it in life as a whole. You know, maybe some of his own f***-ups, maybe people he knew, maybe people in general.

I really do hope that we start this book club at some point in February! I have a little time off during the middle of the month and I can put the ipad to good use.

Who's in charge? I assume either Apple Scruff, hibgal, wildewoman, or Maia. Well, listen up ladies: I would truly appreciate it if you would not assign something very complex or long for the first month. Go easy on me. The only reading I do is either word-related or children's books. I need something a little in between.

Thank you kindly.

Oh my God, I've not read this until now; a million apologies.

Yes, Fly is right, Dorian Graywas Wilde's only published novel. It was all kinds of controversial when it was published, and was even used as evidence against him in his trials.

The plot is basically this: A young man of great physical beauty, Dorian Gray,has his portrait painted by a sensitive (male) artist, Basil Hallward, who, it might be inferred, is in love with him, but in a rather noble, Greek sort of way (remember, Wilde was a Classicist; graduated with a Double First---the highest academic honor--from Oxford for his scholarly work in the ancient Greek Classics). One day Hallward has a very worldly Lord, Lord Henry Wotten, visiting with him, who happens upon this portrait and becomes entranced with it. The artist remarks that he hopes Lord Henry doesn't ever meet Dorian, because Dorian is the artist's ideal of purity and beauty and he knows that Lord Henry will probably be a corrupting influence on Dorian

Well, as it happens, Dorian shows up to pose so Hallward can finish the portrait while Lord Henry is still there, and of course, Lord Henry makes Dorian self-aware of his own beauty and youth, and of the power those qualities can bring him. He also makes Dorian aware of the temporal nature of those qualities.

Sp Dorian makes a wish that this portrait will bear the marks experience, while he remains young.

And of course things go downhill from there; Dorian exploits everyone he ever comes in contact with, he is, as Fly put it, a total a**hole.

There's a LOT more I could go into, but let me tie this into something about John.

Yes, I think it's likely John read it as a child. And it may have been somewhere in the back of his mind when he wrote "Crippled Inside," although I think he had plenty of other examples as well, including himself, of course.

But here's an interesting factoid.

So Albert Goldman wrote a book called "The Lives of John Lennon," and in Scruff's thread John Green said John talked about the different spirits that were within him, right? So one can safely say that perhaps his sense of self was rather fluid, right? I'm not going to discuss what that means in a modern clinical sense, since that's fraught with dissent on this board, but one can say that John's sense of self wasn't exactly fixed in some respects.

Bear with me; I'll tie this together eventually.

So, Wilde once said to an admirer of Dorian Gray about this work: "Basil Hallward is who I think I am; Lord Henry is who the world thinks me; Dorian Gray is who I would like to be - in other ages, perhaps." (I assume he meant physically beautiful--when one thinks about the ungainly, portly Wilde and the slim and beautiful young men he was attracted to, like Bosie Douglas, it's actually kind of poignant.)

The point is, over the course of their lives, both men remarked on their fluid sense of self. I think John struggled with it while Wilde embraced it, but that is one thing they have in common.

Originally Posted by Fly

I was listening to the Imagine album this past weekend (what a damn work of art) and I kept thinking about this book thread that I haven't posted in because I'm not as scholarly as some of you b*tches. Well, low and behold, Crippled Inside starts playing and I remember one of the few books I actually read on my book list in junior high. I think this may have been Oscar Wilde's only published novel, but don't ask me- direct any questions to wildewoman.

Anyway, what struck me in the lyrics of Crippled Inside (which I don't think was written with PAUL in mind at all- John had other people he thought about and I personally think he could have just been singing in general or even about his fine self) is that they run parallele to the underlying theme of this book. There's this dude who is obsessed with his physical appearance, but he's a nasty @**hole and the mirror starts showing his decaying soul/inner person.

And the lyrics in Crippled Inside are:

"You can shine your shoes and wear a suit
You can comb your hair and look quite cute
You can hide your face behind a smile
One thing you can't hide
Is when you're crippled inside"

So I really think that John may have read this book and got the dark, deep theme of it. And he thought about it in life as a whole. You know, maybe some of his own f***-ups, maybe people he knew, maybe people in general.

I really do hope that we start this book club at some point in February! I have a little time off during the middle of the month and I can put the ipad to good use.

Who's in charge? I assume either Apple Scruff, hibgal, wildewoman, or Maia. Well, listen up ladies: I would truly appreciate it if you would not assign something very complex or long for the first month. Go easy on me. The only reading I do is either word-related or children's books. I need something a little in between.

Thank you kindly.

Oh my God, I've not read this until now; a million apologies.

Yes, Fly is right, Dorian Graywas Wilde's only published novel. It was all kinds of controversial when it was published, and was even used as evidence against him in his trials.

The plot is basically this: A young man of great physical beauty, Dorian Gray,has his portrait painted by a sensitive (male) artist, Basil Hallward, who, it might be inferred, is in love with him, but in a rather noble, Greek sort of way (remember, Wilde was a Classicist; graduated with a Double First---the highest academic honor--from Oxford for his scholarly work in the ancient Greek Classics). One day Hallward has a very worldly Lord, Lord Henry Wotten, visiting with him, who happens upon this portrait and becomes entranced with it. The artist remarks that he hopes Lord Henry doesn't ever meet Dorian, because Dorian is the artist's ideal of purity and beauty and he knows that Lord Henry will probably be a corrupting influence on Dorian

Well, as it happens, Dorian shows up to pose so Hallward can finish the portrait while Lord Henry is still there, and of course, Lord Henry makes Dorian self-aware of his own beauty and youth, and of the power those qualities can bring him. He also makes Dorian aware of the temporal nature of those qualities.

Sp Dorian makes a wish that this portrait will bear the marks experience, while he remains young.

And of course things go downhill from there; Dorian exploits everyone he ever comes in contact with, he is, as Fly put it, a total a**hole.

There's a LOT more I could go into, but let me tie this into something about John.

Yes, I think it's likely John read it as a child. And it may have been somewhere in the back of his mind when he wrote "Crippled Inside," although I think he had plenty of other examples as well, including himself, of course.

But here's an interesting factoid.

So Albert Goldman wrote a book called "The Lives of John Lennon," and in Scruff's thread John Green said John talked about the different spirits that were within him, right? So one can safely say that perhaps his sense of self was rather fluid, right? I'm not going to discuss what that means in a modern clinical sense, since that's fraught with dissent on this board, but one can say that John's sense of self wasn't exactly fixed in some respects.

Bear with me; I'll tie this together eventually.

So, Wilde once said to an admirer of Dorian Gray about this work: "Basil Hallward is who I think I am; Lord Henry is who the world thinks me; Dorian Gray is who I would like to be - in other ages, perhaps." (I assume he meant physically beautiful--when one thinks about the ungainly, portly Wilde and the slim and beautiful young men he was attracted to, like Bosie Douglas, it's actually kind of poignant.)

The point is, over the course of their lives, both men remarked on their fluid sense of self. I think John struggled with it while Wilde embraced it, but that is one thing they have in common.

Oh geez, I posted that missive TWICE. Good God. Can a mod delete at least one of them?

Originally Posted by wildewoman

Oh geez, I posted that missive TWICE. Good God. Can a mod delete at least one of them?

Never mind, it could have been posted five times, I still wouldn't understand it; I'm afraid it's just far to heavy and complicated stuff for me...

Snoopy

Originally Posted by wildewoman

So, Wilde once said to an admirer of Dorian Gray about this work: "Basil Hallward is who I think I am; Lord Henry is who the world thinks me; Dorian Gray is who I would like to be - in other ages, perhaps."

I think John has a very similar quote... I'm gonna go looking for it.

Thanks for the awesome analysis/comparison.... it's an interesting connection, and perhaps a peek into the nature of their aesthetics, that both John and Wilde had a fluid sense of self. I think John embraced it at times as well... after all, he used to say how important it was for him to change his looks (hair, beard, etc.) and style and how he liked to go on from one thing to the next (Maharishi to Janov, etc.)... but I think there were times it truly frightened him.

I am in awe of wilde's post. We're not worthy, wilde. See, you really REALLY need to make a John/Oscar thread, but this is a treat. Ok, I love that wilde and Maia admitted that John struggled with his sense of self while oscar embraced it more. In that regard, I believe you're right. John seemed to always be trying to identify himself with whatever new thing he could discover. I believe Oscar pretty much knew himself.

But wilde, now you have me curious...is there a parallel between the men/women that Oscar/John attracted or were attracted to? I just wonder. They both are such fascinating and charismatic souls. I believe Oscar Wilde was the first writer who was universally loved in school by students, no matter gender/race/etc. I think that is interesting. His humor and wit were on level of their own, much like John's.

Day Trippin' Beatles Magazine
2/6/2013
Review: An ex-Beatle in Bermuda: New book documents John Lennon’s historic*visit

http://daytrippin.com/2013/02/06/rev...istoric-visit/

Has anyone bothered to read those "Just William" books? Not typical juvenile fare for us Yanks, but Amazon delivered one of them to me, for a price. They are charming.

Did anybody else buy Lennonology or am I the only one??