BeatleLinks LogoNav Panel New Sites Cool Sites Top Rated Fab Forum Add A Site Link To Us Revolution Radio New Products



Go Back   BeatleLinks Fab Forum > Solo Forums > Menlove Avenue


Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old Jun 17, 2011, 05:50 PM   #1
Maia 66
Sun King
 
Join Date: Sep 09, 2009
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 5,360

Default Random John-Related Discussions

We need a thread to discuss random John-related topics and issues.

I'd like to start with this question: It has been suggested by different sources that John may have actually had a "thing" for Astrid, but because of his devotion to Stu, he never pursued it; rather, he just suffered in silence and wrote Baby's in Black for her. Or that maybe he DID try to pursue it and she rejected him.

Personally, I'm not sure what I think... although it definitely makes sense that he would fancy her. She was sort of his dream girl type, after all. Beautiful (and blonde a la Bardot), arty, bohemian, a strong woman.

Any thoughts on the matter?
__________________

All I want is the truth
Just give me some truth...


Maia 66 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 17, 2011, 08:03 PM   #2
Apple Scruff
Sun King
 
Apple Scruff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 10, 2002
Location: Ohio, USA
Posts: 10,536

Default

Funny you brought that subject up Maia (great thread idea by the way!)...I just came across an adorable pic of John and Astrid:


I think he most likely had a thing for her but it may have been more of just a physical attraction than anything, although she was an artist and he seemed to aspire for that in a partner. I think, due to the fact that his best friend was in love with her, he didn't try anything. I think those stories- like perhaps the underlying tension in the film Backbeat- are trying to add more to their relationship than there really was.

I think Astrid definitely loved John, but more like a brother. She speaks very highly of him so I'm pretty sure he never attempted anything other than innocent flirtation. But, you know, that is just my opinion.
__________________
"Let me live in you..." ~ John Lennon
Apple Scruff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 17, 2011, 09:57 PM   #3
Maia 66
Sun King
 
Join Date: Sep 09, 2009
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 5,360

Default

I think you're spot on. You pretty much articulated exactly what I think on the subject.

Ok, so next topic, I guess. Do you think John would have ever recorded with Dylan? I think that would have been a cool collaboration in, like, the 90s/early 00s.
__________________

All I want is the truth
Just give me some truth...


Maia 66 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 17, 2011, 10:03 PM   #4
Apple Scruff
Sun King
 
Apple Scruff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 10, 2002
Location: Ohio, USA
Posts: 10,536

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maia 66 View Post
I think you're spot on. You pretty much articulated exactly what I think on the subject.

Ok, so next topic, I guess. Do you think John would have ever recorded with Dylan? I think that would have been a cool collaboration in, like, the 90s/early 00s.
I would have LOVED John and Bob to collaborate in the late 90's/early 00's because I love that gritty, old-man, blues stuff and I think John would have been a %$#*# AWESOME old man. He would have just been too cool, much like Bob. OMG, it could have been fab. There aren't enough words...

And I would have loved old John to collaborate with old Lou Reed and possibly have Laurie Anderson and Yoko out there and do some kind of Plastic Ono Band show with people like Mark Ronson and the Black Keys playing along.

I'm so out there with my ideas for old John. lol!
__________________
"Let me live in you..." ~ John Lennon

Last edited by Apple Scruff : Jun 17, 2011 at 10:05 PM.
Apple Scruff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 18, 2011, 05:48 AM   #5
the ninth walrus
Old Brown Shoe
 
the ninth walrus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 09, 2009
Location: bloop
Posts: 3,750
Send a message via Yahoo to the ninth walrus
Default

John Lennon=sexy
__________________
I long haired guys

there's nothing like an afternoon of drinking homemade butter milk and listing to old music.

sǝɯıʇ ʇɐ ǝɟıl

me i'm part Irish
the ninth walrus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 18, 2011, 08:11 AM   #6
Maia 66
Sun King
 
Join Date: Sep 09, 2009
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 5,360

Default

Yes, he was... end of discussion.

__________________

All I want is the truth
Just give me some truth...


Maia 66 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 18, 2011, 09:19 AM   #7
Apple Scruff
Sun King
 
Apple Scruff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 10, 2002
Location: Ohio, USA
Posts: 10,536

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maia 66 View Post
Yes, he was... end of discussion.

I think I'm inspired to make a thread about John's physical allure...yay!
__________________
"Let me live in you..." ~ John Lennon
Apple Scruff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 18, 2011, 11:42 AM   #8
Apple Scruff
Sun King
 
Apple Scruff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 10, 2002
Location: Ohio, USA
Posts: 10,536

Default

I've always been curious about the whole aspect of John having stage fright. It's interesting to the extent that he was plagued by it because I was reading recently about the recording artist Adele (love her) and how she is often paralyzed with stage fright. Well, someone linked to
This Article that had this quote:
Quote:
Even by it’s very rarity, it carries a certain kind of excitement to it. I am talking about the absolutely debilitating effects, you know, like hearing about how John Lennon would throw up before a concert! I am talking about the “scared to death” kind of feelings. I am talking about things that makes us play worse, not better.
And it made me recall several incidents where John admitted to having severe stage fright, like the Live Peace In Toronto concert and when he performed with Elton John. I often wonder if this was normal for him or if it was the onset of having to perform without his three closest friends on stage with him? I think I only read a few incidences where he was that nervous in the Beatles, but I could be off.

Strange how the last people you'd imagine are the ones who are the most nervous.
__________________
"Let me live in you..." ~ John Lennon
Apple Scruff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 18, 2011, 03:27 PM   #9
Maia 66
Sun King
 
Join Date: Sep 09, 2009
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 5,360

Default

It seems like his worst cases of stage fright occurred when he was unsure how he would be received. Like in Toronto and in Madison Square Garden... he wasn't sure if people were going to be happy to see him on stage. (What an insecure twit our Johnny could be!) Elton John and others who were there that amazing Thanksgiving night have said that John received the loudest, longest, wildest reception they had ever heard when he stepped out on stage. It's sad that John didn't always know how deeply people felt affection and admiration for him!
__________________

All I want is the truth
Just give me some truth...



Last edited by Maia 66 : Jun 18, 2011 at 03:35 PM.
Maia 66 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 18, 2011, 03:37 PM   #10
Apple Scruff
Sun King
 
Apple Scruff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 10, 2002
Location: Ohio, USA
Posts: 10,536

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maia 66 View Post
It seems like his worse cases of stage fright occurred when he was unsure how he would be received. Like in Toronto and in Madison Square Garden... he wasn't sure if people were going to be happy to see him on stage. (What an insecure twit our Johnny could be!) Elton John said-- and others who were there that amazing Thanksgiving night-- that John received the loudest, longest, wildest reception he had ever heard when he stepped out on stage. It's sad that John didn't always know how deeply people felt affection and admiration for him!
That is so true. He was apparently very insecure/shy and it baffles me. I think John Lennon is one of the most fascinating celebrities of the 20th century. Just listening to him talk, watching him interviewed, reading his discussions...he oozed so much charisma and appeal. He was hilarious, biting, direct, yet his voice had a very sweet quality to it. Like in the Anthology dvd when you get to the part that they are discussing the "Jesus" statement/apology and John says something like:

Quote:
"People seem to think I'm anti-Christ or anti-religion but it isn't true. I'm a most religious fellow."
Oh my gosh he sounded SO cute when he said that. Like he never took his self so serious that he sounded either a) uber-pretentious or b) super corny

He was always humorous- like a musical Monty Python.
__________________
"Let me live in you..." ~ John Lennon
Apple Scruff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 18, 2011, 03:42 PM   #11
Maia 66
Sun King
 
Join Date: Sep 09, 2009
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 5,360

Default

Quote:
"People seem to think I'm anti-Christ or anti-religion but it isn't true. I'm a most religious fellow."
LOL ~ I was just watching that part of the Anthology yesterday as I was getting ready for work! I had to turn off the tv at that point and it totally made me smile!! I think that came from the 1970 Jann Wenner tapes, which strikes me as even more interesting... since he was supposed to be all bitter and rancorous, as the conventional wisdom goes. Plus, I think he really meant to say that he was spiritual, because I don't think John was ever religious... he WAS, however, spiritual.
__________________

All I want is the truth
Just give me some truth...


Maia 66 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 18, 2011, 03:46 PM   #12
wallrus59
Bulldog
 
wallrus59's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 13, 2010
Posts: 2,084

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple Scruff View Post
That is so true. He was apparently very insecure/shy and it baffles me. I think John Lennon is one of the most fascinating celebrities of the 20th century. Just listening to him talk, watching him interviewed, reading his discussions...he oozed so much charisma and appeal. He was hilarious, biting, direct, yet his voice had a very sweet quality to it. Like in the Anthology dvd when you get to the part that they are discussing the "Jesus" statement/apology and John says something like:



Oh my gosh he sounded SO cute when he said that. Like he never took his self so serious that he sounded either a) uber-pretentious or b) super corny

He was always humorous- like a musical Monty Python.
it was after the Jesus statement, they came to my neck of the woods and i really think that incident and the fireworks he thought were gunshots brought the beatles touring to an end.

btw, i live south of memphis and they played 2 sold out shows in memphis. i know you have seen the clip of brian saying they had sold out since the statement...always made me feel like there redneck take that.

gk.
__________________
_______________________________________


Last edited by wallrus59 : Jun 18, 2011 at 03:49 PM. Reason: add
wallrus59 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 18, 2011, 03:49 PM   #13
Apple Scruff
Sun King
 
Apple Scruff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 10, 2002
Location: Ohio, USA
Posts: 10,536

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maia 66 View Post
Plus, I think he really meant to say that he was spiritual, because I don't think John was ever religious... he WAS, however, spiritual.
I agree. Although the song "Help Me To Help Myself" (I need some money for all the promotion I'm doing for that song) points to him singing about The Lord: "please help me Lord...help me to help myself..."

Gosh it's hard to really put a thumb on him but I think, more than anything, spiritual would be the best word to use. His quote about Gaughin in the Beatles Anthology points to a depth that goes beyond just relating parts of a famous person's life...he was thinking about the reason for living/dying, etc. Very deep stuff.
__________________
"Let me live in you..." ~ John Lennon
Apple Scruff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 18, 2011, 03:51 PM   #14
Apple Scruff
Sun King
 
Apple Scruff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 10, 2002
Location: Ohio, USA
Posts: 10,536

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maia 66 View Post
It seems like his worst cases of stage fright occurred when he was unsure how he would be received. Like in Toronto and in Madison Square Garden... he wasn't sure if people were going to be happy to see him on stage. (What an insecure twit our Johnny could be!) Elton John and others who were there that amazing Thanksgiving night have said that John received the loudest, longest, wildest reception they had ever heard when he stepped out on stage. It's sad that John didn't always know how deeply people felt affection and admiration for him!
Everyone who was there relayed how it was the greatest/most thunderous applause ever heard at MSG. John was totally a legend in his lifetime. I think he WAS aware of it to a degree, but he wrestled with moments of self-doubt.

Next thought: John's arrogance...I love it but I'm going to own it...the man was truly without question quite full of himself at times.
__________________
"Let me live in you..." ~ John Lennon
Apple Scruff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 18, 2011, 03:53 PM   #15
wallrus59
Bulldog
 
wallrus59's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 13, 2010
Posts: 2,084

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple Scruff View Post
I agree. Although the song "Help Me To Help Myself" (I need some money for all the promotion I'm doing for that song) points to him singing about The Lord: "please help me Lord...help me to help myself..."

Gosh it's hard to really put a thumb on him but I think, more than anything, spiritual would be the best word to use. His quote about Gaughin in the Beatles Anthology points to a depth that goes beyond just relating parts of a famous person's life...he was thinking about the reason for living/dying, etc. Very deep stuff.
in the Jesus apology he says "God as a thing or whatever it is" ...i think that's the quote...and by the song grow old he's saying God bless our love.
so i think he was spiritual..and that is a good way to put it.

gk.
__________________
_______________________________________

wallrus59 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 18, 2011, 03:53 PM   #16
Maia 66
Sun King
 
Join Date: Sep 09, 2009
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 5,360

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple Scruff View Post
Next thought: John's arrogance...I love it but I'm going to own it...the man was truly without question quite full of himself at times.
What's that quote? Something like, "Half the time I think I'm a loser and the other half of the time I think Im God Almighty!"

His personality had so many contradictions. If you study history, you'll find that most of the truly great and interesting people were FULL of contradictions!
__________________

All I want is the truth
Just give me some truth...


Maia 66 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 18, 2011, 03:59 PM   #17
Apple Scruff
Sun King
 
Apple Scruff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 10, 2002
Location: Ohio, USA
Posts: 10,536

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maia 66 View Post

His personality had so many contradictions. If you study history, you'll find that most of the truly great and interesting people were FULL of contradictions!
This. All the way.

But actually, John's arrogance: the stance, legs apart,eyes narrowed, very serious expression as he sang really SCARED me as a child. I was far more inclined towards George because he was cute, young, and innocent looking. However, John's songs were always the ones for me. So as I came to read/watch more about him I recognized that, although he could be arrogant, that was not by any means a defining aspect of his character.

It's funny you read the quote he says and than read Helen Shapiro calling him a sweetheart and the "most gentleman" of all the Beatles.

Ugh, this (watch John and Helen- she admitted to being in LOVE with him and only him):
__________________
"Let me live in you..." ~ John Lennon
Apple Scruff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 18, 2011, 04:03 PM   #18
wallrus59
Bulldog
 
wallrus59's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 13, 2010
Posts: 2,084

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple Scruff View Post
This. All the way.

But actually, John's arrogance: the stance, legs apart,eyes narrowed, very serious expression as he sang really SCARED me as a child. I was far more inclined towards George because he was cute, young, and innocent looking. However, John's songs were always the ones for me. So as I came to read/watch more about him I recognized that, although he could be arrogant, that was not by any means a defining aspect of his character.
should of had the beatles cartoons to watch every now and then...would of done away with the being scared...

gk.
__________________
_______________________________________

wallrus59 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 18, 2011, 04:06 PM   #19
Apple Scruff
Sun King
 
Apple Scruff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 10, 2002
Location: Ohio, USA
Posts: 10,536

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by wallrus59 View Post
should of had the beatles cartoons to watch every now and then...would of done away with the being scared...

gk.
I know. My parents were such barbarians. But of course my dad had no problem watching Miami Vice and Magnum PI with me any time. lol!
__________________
"Let me live in you..." ~ John Lennon
Apple Scruff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 18, 2011, 05:10 PM   #20
Maia 66
Sun King
 
Join Date: Sep 09, 2009
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 5,360

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple Scruff View Post
But actually, John's arrogance: the stance, legs apart,eyes narrowed, very serious expression as he sang really SCARED me as a child.
He must have been something to see on stage in the pre-megastadium days! That arrogance was part of his immense charisma. After all, he could back it up... he was hot s**t and he knew it. He used to go around Liverpool when he was a young kid (like 7 or something) and get on the bus and declare to strangers, "I'm John Lennon!" as if he knew he was something special.

But the more sensitive side of John also had that insecurity.... and also that honesty to say, "I'm just a person like anyone else. Who am I trying to BS?"

I call it the Burden of Perspicacity. When you have that ability that John had to clearly see through things, to understand people for who they are, to be incredibly perceptive... it seems like a blessing but really it's a burden, because it carries with it that other side. That side of KNOWING what a drag people can be, of knowing that NOTHING is so special that we have to hold it more precious and high above everything else. John had that... and it came across as arrogance.
__________________

All I want is the truth
Just give me some truth...


Maia 66 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
John Lennon and Yoko Ono's Wedding Anniversary - March 20th Lucy Menlove Avenue 0 Mar 21, 2010 04:33 AM
Fanfiction question Loony_leo Paperback Writer 275 Dec 05, 2007 07:53 PM
From thewayoflife.org Tim I Read The News Today 75 Mar 31, 2006 07:30 PM
The incident that split John and Paul Tim Abbey Road 32 Mar 15, 2004 06:27 PM
1975-02 - Rolling Stone Magazine - John Lennon Jerry The Word 0 Jun 16, 2003 07:00 AM


Advertisements

All times are GMT -8. The time now is 04:42 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Site Features
Search Links

  Advanced Search
Category Jump



BeatleMail

FREE E-MAIL
@ BEATLEMAIL.COM


Username


Password




New User Sign-Up!
Lost Password?
Beatles History




Donate
The costs of running our database and discussion forum are steadily rising. Any help we receive is greatly appreciated. Click HERE for more information about donating to BeatleLinks.
Extras
» Chat Room
» Current News
» Monthly Contest
» Interviews Database
» Random Site
» Banner Exchange
» F.A.Q.
» Advertise
» Credits
» Legal
» Contact Us
Copyright © 2000-2018 BeatleLinks
All Rights Reserved