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Old Nov 11, 2002, 12:17 PM   #61
beatlebangs1964
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

In the interest of fairness, I read the story and REALLY didn't like it. This sort of thing does not appeal to me. Now I know what it is and stories of that ilk, I know what I don't care for and personally don't support.

------------------
Then we will remember things we said today. Yeah.
-- Beatles, 1964

With a love like that, you know you should be glad, yeah, yeah, yeah!
-- Beatles, 1963

Read www.rooftopsessions.com for high caliber Beatles fan fiction.

BB1964
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Old Nov 11, 2002, 12:22 PM   #62
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Tahoma, Arial, Sans-Serif">Quote:</font><HR>Originally Posted By Drumhead15:
My one basic opinion on writing sex scenes is keep it subtle. You don't have to get too descriptive for the reader to be able to grasp what's happening and let their imagination take over. Each person has different limits on how much they want to know, if you keep it subtle, the reader only knows what they want to.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>



Beautifully said, Ashley. That is, IMHO a mature view of intercourse. That was the approach I have always taken. However, I am not adverse to trying my hand at erotica provided it is expressed in clean, tasteful language and fits in with the flow and characters in the story. As long as it ain't slash or gay fiction about real people who are straight, I am okay with it.



------------------
Then we will remember things we said today. Yeah.
-- Beatles, 1964

With a love like that, you know you should be glad, yeah, yeah, yeah!
-- Beatles, 1963

Read www.rooftopsessions.com for high caliber Beatles fan fiction.

BB1964
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Old Nov 11, 2002, 12:27 PM   #63
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

Yeah, thats a good way of putting it Ash! Well I'm personally at this mental block in regards to John and my characters dance lesson...because I know what I want to happen (BOY! do I...)but putting it down so I'm not to plain or too over the top...THAT's me problem...ah well...got to get in touch with my pysche I suppose

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Old Nov 11, 2002, 12:33 PM   #64
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

John -- that should be interesting. And yeah, erotica IS a part of the psyche. If expressed tastefully and if it fits in with the story, then it can be a decided enhancement.

------------------
Then we will remember things we said today. Yeah.
-- Beatles, 1964

With a love like that, you know you should be glad, yeah, yeah, yeah!
-- Beatles, 1963

Read www.rooftopsessions.com for high caliber Beatles fan fiction.

BB1964

[This Message Has Been Edited By beatlebangs1964 On November 11, 2002 01:34 PM]
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Old Nov 11, 2002, 12:51 PM   #65
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Tahoma, Arial, Sans-Serif">Quote:</font><HR>Originally Posted By beatlebangs1964:
In the interest of fairness, I read the story and REALLY didn't like it. This sort of thing does not appeal to me. Now I know what it is and stories of that ilk, I know what I don't care for and personally don't support.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Well I have read some slash and enjoyed it...but that story was bad. Like would George ever say something so retarded...and would Ringo and John ever go along with it. I think its daft. But not all slash fics are bad...I read some good ones. Of course, it had to do with gay characters!! ANYWAY--enough about that.


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Old Nov 11, 2002, 01:03 PM   #66
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

I've already said my piece about slash fic many times, you all know where I stand on that. I don't like it, mostly because the slash I have read is just way over the top as far as I am concerned...way too unbelievable and way too angst-ridden.

Now...regarding writing erotica. I've read a lot of romance novels in my life. Some are more graphic than others, but most are tasteful. I have even read erotic fiction that uses so-called dirty words, but in the context, is not dirty at all. It all depends on how it is handled. But I do think that reading romantic and erotic fiction can help a writer decide what they want to say when they write it themselves...and how far they want to go.

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Rooftop Sessions - The Finest In Beatles-Related Fiction. November 2002 Issue Now Up!

"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans." - John Lennon
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Old Nov 11, 2002, 01:10 PM   #67
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Tahoma, Arial, Sans-Serif">Quote:</font><HR>Originally Posted By HMVNipper:
Now...regarding writing erotica. I've read a lot of romance novels in my life. Some are more graphic than others, but most are tasteful. I have even read erotic fiction that uses so-called dirty words, but in the context, is not dirty at all. It all depends on how it is handled. But I do think that reading romantic and erotic fiction can help a writer decide what they want to say when they write it themselves...and how far they want to go.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

So I should read other romance and erotic books FIRST, then right down what I want to happen or vice versa? Or am I making it just to difficult...LOL

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Old Nov 11, 2002, 01:17 PM   #68
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Tahoma, Arial, Sans-Serif">Quote:</font><HR>Originally Posted By bitagirl:
So I should read other romance and erotic books FIRST, then right down what I want to happen or vice versa? Or am I making it just to difficult...LOL

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, it helps to see how other writers handle it if you are unsure about what to do yourself. This does NOT mean you should copy word for word, of course, but it can help you figure out how to handle such scenes in your own work.

One of the best pieces of advice I can give to any writer of any genre and type is to read, and read widely, across genres. Even if you are, say, a science fiction writer, it can help greatly to read mysteries or romances, in case those things ever come up in your SF stories. Also, reading books about writing can be very helpful -- one that I can recommend very highly off the top of my head is Stephen King's "On Writing," which is partly his autobiography (which is interesting) and partly his approach to his craft. It is THAT part that I feel is particularly valuable, because it allows you to see how a successful writer approaches what he does. There are other books of the same ilk around -- I think Margaret Atwood did a similar kind of book recently, for example.

I'm going off on all kinds of tangents here, but I hope that some of this is helpful to you, Cynthia! (BTW, did you get the email I sent you off list yesterday? Just wondering...)

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Rooftop Sessions - The Finest In Beatles-Related Fiction. November 2002 Issue Now Up!

"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans." - John Lennon
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Old Nov 11, 2002, 01:22 PM   #69
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

Thanks Susan, you have helped me alot. I shall do some reading, and then approach my story in a different light. Thanks again for the insight!

(Yes, I got the email...and I'll be sending you my feedback soon!)

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Old Nov 11, 2002, 01:27 PM   #70
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Tahoma, Arial, Sans-Serif">Quote:</font><HR>Originally Posted By bitagirl:
Thanks Susan, you have helped me alot. I shall do some reading, and then approach my story in a different light. Thanks again for the insight!

(Yes, I got the email...and I'll be sending you my feedback soon!)

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You are most welcome, Cynthia! I hope that you can get your story the way you want it!

(BTW, I was asking about the email because I was having some problems with things with attachments getting lost in the ether...I hope you didn't think I was being a noodge! )

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Rooftop Sessions - The Finest In Beatles-Related Fiction. November 2002 Issue Now Up!

"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans." - John Lennon
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Old Nov 11, 2002, 02:08 PM   #71
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

One of the reasons I like www.rooftopsessions.com is that the magazine provides useful writing tips, well-written, believable Beatle fiction and it is a good place to draw references, approaches and ideas.



------------------
Then we will remember things we said today. Yeah.
-- Beatles, 1964

With a love like that, you know you should be glad, yeah, yeah, yeah!
-- Beatles, 1963

Read www.rooftopsessions.com for high caliber Beatles fan fiction.

BB1964
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Old Nov 11, 2002, 02:26 PM   #72
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

I write some porn for men's mags, and I have even done a couple of books... I found out that porn was easy to write and sell, although it's a bit hard sometimes for me to use certain words which I would never say in real life.
Anyhow, I read some porn, and for the most part it was just so terrible! Horribly thin plots, if any, inane dialogue, and stupid, one dimesional characters. I thought that I could do better, and I think I do. I am working on a xxx novel now, the first I have written in twenty years. I sell the odd short story, though.
The point is, if you want to learn to write, it's true-- you have to read, read, read! And do read the articles concerning the writer's craft in http://www.rooftopsessions.com

Lots of good advice in there!

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And in the end, the love you take is equal to the love you make.
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Old Nov 11, 2002, 03:57 PM   #73
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

Well I do already write...but have I ever wrote a story with real characters..not really...but I will read the articles at rooftop sessions for some pointers! Thanks again, you guys!

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Old Nov 11, 2002, 06:17 PM   #74
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

I'm not against erotica. In many instances, I LOVE it!

When I was younger, so much younger than today, I read some of those stupid Beeline books. The characters WERE one-dimensional and the only plot was intercourse with embellishments and vulgar language.

Now, I really am not against porn, but I didn't like the Beeline books. I even read the Happy Hooker and other racy books for, shall we say pleasure?

Angel, you have a real gift for writing and I'd love to read your "racy" stories. I can't wait to read your Christmas story on Rooftop Sessions!

------------------
Then we will remember things we said today. Yeah.
-- Beatles, 1964

With a love like that, you know you should be glad, yeah, yeah, yeah!
-- Beatles, 1963

Read www.rooftopsessions.com for high caliber Beatles fan fiction.

BB1964
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Old Nov 11, 2002, 06:36 PM   #75
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Tahoma, Arial, Sans-Serif">Quote:</font><HR>Originally Posted By beatlebangs1964:
I'm not against erotica. In many instances, I LOVE it!

When I was younger, so much younger than today, I read some of those stupid Beeline books. The characters WERE one-dimensional and the only plot was intercourse with embellishments and vulgar language.

Now, I really am not against porn, but I didn't like the Beeline books. I even read the Happy Hooker and other racy books for, shall we say pleasure?

Angel, you have a real gift for writing and I'd love to read your "racy" stories. I can't wait to read your Christmas story on Rooftop Sessions!

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Your wish is my command; you will find a sample in your email!



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Old Nov 11, 2002, 06:55 PM   #76
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

I'm coming in a little late to the topic (damn those academic requirements one needs to fulfill to pass in grad school...), but there's a few things to note here that might offer some additional perspective.

First off, I don't know if the rules of logic really apply all that much to sexual encounters, so anything we can say about what makes for a "proper" sex scene may just be smoke. When people get aroused, and they become receptive to arousal, it happens without any real guide to behavior except for primal urge. Sometimes it's very slow, and sometimes it's almost instant, but when the dominos start to tumble that's it.

And the big thing to remember as the second point is, not everyone's going to feel the same way about their urges all the time. Sometimes the most "proper" of people fall to their desires. It's not the act itself that makes those who resist the urge venerable in Western literary and philosophical tradition, it's the ability to rise above an all too common, overpowering desire for it that can hit at any time. Maybe 999 times someone who goes out for the night doesn't expect to wake up the next morning anywhere but their own bed, but that one time in a thousand it happens.

At the risk of going out on a limb, yes, men are more likely to give in to their urge than women, and so men are more likely to just say, "Ug! Good! Mine!!" and start their campaign without warning. Not that women don't get the urge either; if they didn't, we wouldn't have an overpopulation problem. Suffice it to say, men are more likely to go forth and multiply, and often without more reason than just the way the light danced on her breasts for an instant. (Why men are more likely to go for it is probably better left to another post devoted to the topic.)

So where does that leave us? If a scene has two people meeting for the first time, and he makes a pass right away, and she says yes with very little pause, and it goes forth from there... Well, it's not entirely out of the realm of experience. It happens, frequently, and more often than not to someone else, but frequently.

So why the need for a more structured encounter in fiction? Because we expect something more erudite in our fiction. This is true whether you compare a written love scene with an actual sexual encounter, or THE SOPRANOS with the government's taped evidence in the Gotti trials, or LAW & ORDER with either a taped confession to police or a trial transcript. Because what we write, we improve on, try to make better than reality, if for no other reason than our minds, even our souls, want an environment to immerse in that's an improvement over what they see and feel.

So if you have a scene on paper where the guy, Beatle or otherwise, seems pretty quick out of the gate, you could try and slow it down by any number of means, but you have to ask yourself, "Is this true?" Not "Is it true to the character?" because as noted elsewhere that's an elastic quality, and even saints were known to need a good cold shower later. No, the question to ask is not so much a behavioral one as a pacing one, if the story's pace is enhanced or compromised.

And if the pace seems wrong as your characters "encounter" each other, maybe that's a major part of the story right there. Maybe rash action and its consequences are what the piece is all about, or perhaps it's the failure to act on the moment that speaks volumes about how well these characters function.

Okay, I've had a good rant; back to the books...

------------------
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"Like Kurasawa I make mad films
Okay I don't make films
but if I did they'd have a Samurai"
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Old Nov 11, 2002, 07:14 PM   #77
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

OMG Thanks JD!!
I think you just helped me nail the problem on the head!

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- Malcolm X
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Old Nov 11, 2002, 07:21 PM   #78
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

When you're writing about (or actually experiencing) an encounter with someone as famous as our sweet boys, though, sometimes the opportunity just has to be seized at once; once that Beatle or ex-Beatle walks away, it is unlikely that you (or your character) are going to run into him again--ever.So it is a matter of having to carpe diem, ya know? There's no time to play hard to get, unless it is a pre-Fab story. That is my take on it, anyhow, and that is also why I gave it up to John right away even though I was a "good girl".Well, that was part of it anyway...he really WAS just so...mmmm! It was like, now or never. Had I not succumbed that first night, I very much doubt that I would ever have seen the man again, and that would have indeed been a shame and a lifelong regret.

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And in the end, the love you take is equal to the love you make.
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Old Nov 11, 2002, 07:31 PM   #79
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

True Angel, but I finally got the missing link to my story!!!

Like I said before, all John would have to do is scratch his forehead...and I'll be ALL HIS!!!!!

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"You can't separate peace from freedom because no one can be at peace unless he has his freedom. "
- Malcolm X
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Old Nov 11, 2002, 07:43 PM   #80
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Default Re: Why Don\'t We Do It In the Fic?

I am really looking forward to reading this famous fic of yours--Cynthia, is it?

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