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Old Jun 06, 2003, 09:30 AM   #1
Jerry
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Default Everybody Please Read...

I'd like everybody here to read this post. It's a series of e-mails between a former member of the forum and myself. The guy challenged me to post them, and I have absolutely nothing to hide here. I won't comment about this anymore, I refuse to deal with people that don't live in the real world. I'll just let the messages speak for themselves.

--------------------

Dear Jerry,
I am Maharishi Mahesh Yogi from Beatlelinks, and i am writing to you out of concern about the whole recent debate about the controversial lennon conspiracy site listed in your directory..I do not wish to enter into the argument, which has been argued ad nasuem already, and has been a very unpleasnat experience for many already..Walrus Egg's crusade against the site has been counterproductive, and very messy as his/her intent has done nothing but promote the site to many who would never have even been exposed to it..
However i am writing to you to request you withdraw the site from your directory..the site and its author's homepage is distictly anti-jewish in nature, and is a jewish conspiracy site..whether or not people will even read it (granted, unlikely) or whether the constitution grants people the right to freedom of speech is irrelevant, as we too have the right to support/ speak out against such views..Fundamentally while we may not be able to stop such people and their views, we do not need to encourage them. The mentioned site is censored and blocked by Websense (www.websense.com) citing "Racism/hate" reasons (simply register there, and type in the sites URL) . Even the notorious "historian" David Irving has labelled the author, Salvador Astucia (who uses a pseudonym btw) as "anti-semetic". I am worried because the purpose of beatlelinks is, for me at least, a fun place where fans of the fab four! can gather to discuss the music and magic of the beatles, not be sucked into a negative hate circle, the results of which have recently been witnessed at (of all places) "menlove avenue".
The whole "Jewish" factor almost acts as a misnomer, as the implication of the innocence of C******* (an assertion of the site) is a great affront to John Lennon fans. With all due respect, a Beatle fan site should not be listing a link which mantains John Lennon's Killer is Innocent, regardless of any subjective view point. Jerry, I implore you to remove this insidious link from your great site..i would like to leave you with some words from George Harrison's Wreck of the Hesperus:

"Poison Pen men sneak
Never learn to speak
Make up lies, and they leak em out...
Behind the pseudonym, the Rotteness in them
Reaching out trying to touch me!" -GH

It is up to us if we let ourselves, and others, be touched..Thank you for your time, and for listening to me, i really appreciate it..

Repectfully, yours
Daniel Phillips
MMY
--------------------
Thanks for your message. First of all, I think you need to realize something about my site. I consider it to be divided into two main sections. One is just simply a listing of links to Beatles-related sites. The other is the forum. My directory of links is not based on opinions, and it certainly has nothing to do with site content. In other words, my opinion of the site doesn't change anything. I list ANY and ALL Beatles-related sites, with basically no exceptions. Would it be right for me to remove links to sites I disagree with, or to sites that I personally don't like? That would be my choice, but then I think that would be wrong too. If I don't like the Sgt. Pepper LP, should I then remove a site that analyzes the album? Seriously, answer that question. I don't think so. These are OPINIONS, and everybody has a different one. I don't care if that site's author is anti-anything, it really has nothing to do with me. I'm just linking to Beatles-related sites, and I think you need to realize this. His site, or at least a few pages of it, are Beatles-related, there's no way around it. And just to be sure, I clearly state this on my site:
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BeatleLinks does not vouch for the accuracy or content of the sites linked from our database. The opinions expressed on this site or on a site linked from our directory are not necessarily those of BeatleLinks.
---
Now if this kind of stuff happens on my forum, then that is something different. Unlike the sites I link to, I have control over the forum, and it is part of my site. So if something is posted that doesn't belong in a Beatles discussion, then I usually do something about it. I think you saw the results of this. Once it became an issue on my forum, I did something about it. In fact, it caused a huge problem for me, but I think I did the right thing. And since you left me with words of Harrison, I'll leave you with a similar thought too. Wasn't it Lennon who did this exact same thing? Shocking people by expressing his opinions about war, about religion, etc. I'm a little surprised people out there just can't ignore crap like this. I mean, put it into context, ignore it, and then let's just forget about it. Like you said, the guy and his site have already received more attention than they deserve.
-Jerry-
--------------------
Hi Jerry,
Thanks for your reply. You raised some interesting points. When you mention that you list all sites in your directory, "without exception" i wonder whether this would include anti beatles, or beatles hate sites?? I would like to presume that you would not..The site in question, is not a beatles related site it is a john lennon conspiracy page ( part of a jewish conspiracy site) that boldy claims his killer is innocent...of course it is talking about John lennon, or at least his murder, but proclaiming his killer as innocent is reprehensible, and something beatle fans should not have to find on their friendly beatle fan site..the site should not be listed there for these reasons, and find it is disgusting it is..
Secondly, this issue, contrary to your claims, does have something to do with you, as it is on your site..you choose what can and cannot be listed..By simply saying anything can and will be listed, regardless of its nature, shows a deep lack of discretion i feel..Links to hate sites that persecute religious groups and ethnicities, and that deny events such as the holocaust is your responsiblity if you knowingly allow it to be advertised on your site. With respect, comparing your responsiblity on this matter to your opinion on better or worse beatle albums, is a serious lack of judgement..sure, your discretion should not be used to simply allow your opinion obvious on trifle matters, but would you allow a link to a child pornography site that mentioned the beatles for example?
If your policy DOES NOT permit deleting links of any kind, i strongly recomend you review and change this policy, because i can only see this matter becoming a more common occurance otherwise...
In regards to your legal disclaimer, i understand and respect that..But the legal disclaimer does not exempt you from a moral responsiblity to enforce basic social and moral values guranteed by the constitution to protect the rights of everybody..Im sure you will agree that it is wrong that in the year 2003, people are still being persecuted for their race, color, religion or culture..whether you choose to uphold or condemn such discrimination is paramount to whether or not you allow this link (and others in the future, like it) to stay on your site..
Ultimately only you have control over the content of both your boards, and link database, you just choose to excercise it over your sagebaords only. This is your choice.
I would also like to remind you that the mentioned site is classified as "Racist/hate" by websense, and it has been reported to the ADL (Anti Defamation league) Is this the sort of site you want linked to your forum?..I am also reporting the site to Elliot Mintz (publicist to Yoko Ono and Bob Dylan) and as it contains copywrited images and lyrics, i am presuming litigation will ensue if the offending content is not removed...
I would like to leave you with some words from salvador astucia (the seudonym of the author of the site), in an email to me..

"Individual Jews are human beings like anyone else. I've known some decent Jews, but that does not diminish the fact that the Jewish culture encourages dishonesty. The culture--not individual Jews--promotes lying. There is a Jewish prayer, the Kol Nidre, which encourages the breaking of vows. This is where the stereotype originated about Jews being dishonest liars..... Many people admired Hitler. I am not prepared to state that he was a great guy, but he was certainly not the monster he is portrayed by Jewish groups and the western media at large."

Is this the sort of person you want to link your beatles site too? the (especially considering these views are publically aired throughout the site) This is the sort of person and the ideas your uncensored airing of links is freely promoting..
Lastly i would also request that if the link must stay, that my membership to your forum be reluctantly deleted. I have never, and will never be a member of a hate forum, or a good one that provides links to one..i hope i am not the only person that feels this way, and indeed that you do too. And in regards to John Lennon, i was always under the impression he was a great humanitarian that relentlessy campaigned and championed the rights of others (often using shock and publicity seeking campaigns to do so) regardless of race, creed, color and religion and someone who was a great man of peace . I have no doubt what his views on this subject would be..unfortunately he's not here to share them with us, and that is disgusting considering the claims of the site about the person (who's name i will not mention), who is responsible for the silence we hear now....
I respect your decision, and again much gratitude for reading my comments, yours faithfully,
Daniel Phillips
--------------------
Look, I've already spent more time on this than I should have. Yeah, as a matter of fact, I do link to anti-Beatles sites. They're lame and useless, just like the Lennon site, but I link to them. They're Beatles-related, and this is something that you just don't seem to understand. Do you really think they're spreading hate around the world? If anybody were to go to these sites from my directory, they'd probably laugh or just close the window and that would be that.And that's exactly what you should do. If you want to start a world campaign against the site, then that's your waste of time. If more people were to protest about the link, then I'd probably put something in the site's description warning users about it.
The disclaimer on my site is more than enough, most people don't even bother with that much. I'm not some crusader, protecting the moral constitutional rights of web surfers out there. I just run a Beatles site, don't make this out to be some huge deal. So far, the site has a WHOPPING 46 hits from my site. What does that tell you? People don't care about the site, and they're not even visiting it. Out of those 46 hits, most of them probably came from the topics on my forum. And furthermore, the site does contain some material that might be useful for people wishing to investigate John's murder, such as Chapman's transcripts, Dakota maps, etc. So to some people out there, it's worthwhile. Maybe not you, maybe not me, but probably for others.
Secondly, it seems that you're implying that I'm anti-Jewish or something, and I deeply resent that. I had tons of Jewish friends growing up, and my closest friends now are Jewish. Brett is Jewish, he started BeatleLinks with me, and still helps me out. In fact, I hung out with him last night, and we talked about this. He thinks it's ridiculous that people can't just ignore the site. If I forwarded your e-mail to him, I guarantee you that his response to you would be angry and rude. I will even go further by telling you that I'm Armenian, and if you know your history, then you know that my ancestors were also the victims of genocide in the early 20th century, including my great grandparents and many more family members. So please, don't talk down to me like I don't know anything about hate or racism.
Just ignore the Lennon site, or don't bother using my site or forum again. Sorry, it's my decision. I won't delete your forum registration. Just stop using the forum if that's the way you feel, I have no control over that. I resent the fact that you called my forum a hate forum, that's the most ridiculous thing you could ever say about me or my site. But I will tell you this much, DO NOT go on my forum and start posting about how I ignored your messages or about how I'm anti-Jewish or something like that. I was more than patient with you.
Either stop using the forum or just deal with it. It's your choice, just like it's anybody's choice whether or not to visit the site.
-Jerry-
--------------------
Hi Jerry,
Well i must say i am very disapointed and saddened by your very rude reply..i NEVER said or implied you were anti jewish or racist at all, that is something you have completly invented..likewise i DID NOT call links a "hate site" at any time, infact i described it as a "good site with links to one" (refering to the hate site) which it undeniably does..Also at no time, did i "talk down to you" or attempt to lecture you about hate or racism. If i appeared to be condescending, i apologise, that was never my intention..
Also, with all due respect, i dont really care about how many "Jewish friends" you have or what they would say to me, i too have some, and they are backing me up all the way. Im not after any praise or credit, i know whats right...I doubt your friend would be as rude and angry towards me as you have, and if he is, well thats his wish...What have i done thats so bad? stick up for some people?? I am offended that you believe i would trash you on your own forum..why would i say you ignored me?? and i am not the one that called you anti jewish, you are the only one who has brought that one up.. So you can rest easy, i am not going to start slagging you off to your forum members, i do not believe in spreading hate on the internet, or anywhere else for that matter..
lastly i must repeat my request that my membership is please deleted, as i do not intend to use your forum again (maybe there is some way i can delete it?) again i reiterate i have never been a member of a hate site, or any site that carries links to one, nor will i ever be..i would also like to say in all my repeated emails with the author of the concerned website, he has always treated me with a reasonable level of respect and decency, (depsite my repeated attacks on his hate site) something you did not afford me on your last email simply asking for you to consider removing the link.....i believe that speaks for itself...and contary to your claim, you didnt show much patience with me either, ..1 email before you fly off the handle, thats patience? i hope you dont treat all members of your forum this way (especially the ones who believe they have a moral responsibilty to stand up for what they believe is right, what a crime that is) i think its wrong that there's this PC crap "idea"that people like muself have to be "tolerated" in this day and age, when lets face it, all you really want to do is tell me is piss off and get a life..its a sad thing these days when people actually still care about things, and have values isnt it??
Anyway you have reserved your decision, and thats fine..i cant do anything about that, its your decision,(that we both can agree on) and you must live with it...im sad you took such offence from me, and refuse to look at the truth right in front of you..it seems to me your getting angry at the wrong thing..
anyway, until then i will continue to "waste my time" and "dream my life away". Thats my decison, and Jerry, i wouldnt have it any other way...
PAX UM BISCUM
PEACE BE WITH YOU!
daniel
MMY
--------------------
You know what, we just disagree, accept it. And by the way, here's what you said...
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Lastly i would also request that if the link must stay, that my membership to your forum be reluctantly deleted. I have never, and will never be a member of a hate forum, or a good one that provides links to one...
---
Now you tell me, was I wrong to assume that you're calling my forum a hate forum, or at least one that tolerates it? Those were your words, not mine. Don't use the forum if you don't want to, but I'm not deleting your membership. You can erase most of the fields in the profile if you wish, but I'm not bothering to delete your name, you're the one that signed up.
--------------------
Yes, you are misinterpreting what i said:
" I have never, and will never be a member of a hate forum, or a good one that provides links to one..."
by that i mean "good one", as a good forum that provides links to a hate forum..i am saying your forum links to one, and you would be right to assume that i believe you are tolerating one..but there is a big distinction between that and labelling beatlelinks a "hate forum" something it clearly is not, and something i have never said it was..like i said i dont want to be associated with any forum that does have such links, and when i did sign up to beatlelinks i was unaware that it did..if i had of known, i would never have bothered to have joined..i am glad i did though because i have met some great people, made some great friends and exchanged some great ideas..i feel very sad i have to leave, but i feel i have no option but to.. obviously you value your links more than you do your members...
Anyway, we've probably said all there needs to be said about this, but just FYI i received this email today from Genesis publications who i contacted about the site:

"Thanks for your email about breach of copyright. I visited the site and you’re quite right, it’s appalling and not something we wish to be associated with at all. Apart from the Klaus Voorman painting, there are also images from Astrid Kircherr and Bob Gruen on the site who, as you probably know, we have worked with extensively in the past. I am certain neither would like their work to be associated with such disgusting views either. We will be letting the artists know and have contacted our lawyers. They will be writing to the site demanding that the offending material be removed. It’s just unfortunate we can’t do more to shut the site down completely in my opinion. Once again, many thanks, Robby Elson"

again, im sorry we dont see eye to eye..but thats the way life is sometimes...
Peace!
daniel
--------------------
I think reading your e-mails is torture. I am not tolerating a hate site, I just link to it because it's Beatles-related. Get that through your unbelievably thick head. Let's see...Yahoo lists the site in their directory, are you going to start a worldwide campaign against them too? You have a Hotmail account, and you can find the site through the search engine on the MSN Hotmail page. Now, since you're so high and mighty, I'll assume you'll cancel your Hotmail account in protest as well? According to your ridiculous logic, Yahoo and Microsoft and just about every other company tolerates hate. You might as well go live on a mountain buddy. Too bad you have to live with yourself. Go get a life, leave me alone, and just go away.
--------------------
Famous last words from a Yogi:
Jerry, this is the last time i will contact you on this matter..
I cant believe how incredibly rude you are being...i challenge you to post what you just said about me on your forum, and see what sort of response you get from the members of your forum..you are a hateful bigot!!...i have done nothing wrong to you, and you condemn me and attack me for my views because i dare speak up about your choice to link to hate sites..if i type in JL in yahoo i do not get the site, in say the first 10,000 listed pages or so..you only link to about 40 JL sites in total!! what a joke!!..but yes, i aknowledge the internet is full of hate sites, this is the problem, its got to start somewhere...and i would never cancel my hotmail account, because then i wouldnt be able to torture you, like now..Stop being so pedantic, your making a fool of yourself!...
and again, i dare u to just post what you said about me on your forum, but NO, you would never do that would you???..i have been very respectful of you despite our very differing views on something very important to me, and been nothing but polite..no wonder your so paranoid about people criticising you on your forum, do you treat everyone this bad??..
Genesis publications legal action against the site validates my concerns, and your attempt to belittle me doesnt weaken my resolve one bit, infact it strenthens it, as complacency fools one into being asleep...you are nothing more than a bully that gets upset when you dont get your own way...
Despite all this, i bear you no ill will, and wish you well, despite your crude comments...
ill leave you with this:

"All Evil needs to triumph is for Good men to stay silent"
-Dr Martin Luther King jr

thats the last i have to say on the matter, Jerry i sincerly hope you can leave your hate and anger behind you, it really is no good for anyone, least of all yourself..
PEACE!!
your brother, Daniel
Pax um Biscum!
--------------------
I guess you didn't get the part where I said get a life and go away. Since you can't seem to get a life, then just GO AWAY. And you know what, I will post ALL of this on my forum this weekend. I have nothing to hide, look for it in a few days.
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Old Jun 06, 2003, 10:07 AM   #2
Brett
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Default Re: Everybody Please Read...

Well I have much to say here, being that I am Jewish, and also happen to have a stake in the server that BeatleLinks is run on.

First off, Jerry was far more cordial to you than he had to be. He made a decision, and you did not accept it, but you tried to turn the whole thing around as if you were the victim. I found that particularly rude, and then of course there were the several attempts at calling Jerry anti-semitic, which is about as pathetic and as un-called for as possible.

I am Jerry's friend, been his friend for over 25 years, we all grew up in a predominantly Jewish area of Los Angeles, and for you to go on implying that he somehow holds hate for Jews is disgusting, you should be ashamed of yourself. And don't tell me you didn't IMPLY it, you did, you even went so far as to call this site a "hate forum." You disgust me to no end.

Well as Jew, one who was Bar Mitzvahed and is proud of his heritage, I am telling you you are way out of line, and it stops now. Jerry is not promoting this web site, he simply linked to an area of it that discussed the Beatles. And that is relevant. You have, however, given this ridiculous site that probably gets 5 hits a year more mention than it ever deserved. Then you in turn have the audacity to treat Jerry as if he created the site and call him anti-semitic. Jerry responded to you in a very polite and dignified way for quite a few of those e-mails, but eventually everyone tires of dealing with a person who resorts to such juvenile antics of name-calling and finger-pointing, as you did. You were rude time and time again, and how dare you assume in any way how I would respond to the inclusion of that web site. You don't know me and you certainly don't have any idea how I feel about my Jewish heritage.

Furthermore, why don't you try campaigning against Yahoo! and EVERY other mega search engine. They all list the site in question in their directories as well Mr. Holier Than Thou. In fact I notice you use Hotmail, which is owned by Microsoft. Well I hope you realize that the site does show up in the search results at MSN. In fact, why don't you start up a world-wide campaign against Bill Gates and Microsoft for their anti-semitic views Mr. Hyporcrite? And don't give me the BS it doesn't show up in these search results (ie Yahoo!), it absolutely does, it's just way down the list. Did you expect it to appear at the top of the search results or something??? It's a horrible web site with almost no activiity that YOU have managed to make far more important than what it's worth. Good work genius.

You keep saying Jerry is "rude because he didn't get his way." What are you talking about? He was only rude after you insinuated he was anti-semitic several times, and the only person not getting their way is YOU numbnuts. Jerry is getting "his way," the site is in the directory still and you're crying about it, even after he told you of his position. So what are you talking about? You just don't like the answer because it's not what you want to hear. As far as I can tell, you just continue to harrass him because he doesn't see eye-to-eye with you on this ridiculous crusade you're on.

Jerry was far more lenient with you than I would have been that's for sure. You're nothing but a troublemaker, and you compound it with your name-calling, childish insults. I would have told you to screw off a long time ago. I would love to hear you respond to this, but I doubt you will since you have been banned, per your request I might add.

Thanks for drawing attention to a web site that would have fallen off the face of the earth unnoticed had it not been for your useless drivel. As a Jewish person, let me tell you this, don't do us anymore favors, just go about your business and let others police the internet world. You suck at it.

Have a nice day. Oh and feel free to e-mail me at webmaster@vhlinks.com. You seem to be very interested in the welfare of the Jewish faith, I'm interested to know what you have done of actual worth to help preserve our religion.

[size="1"][ Jun 06, 2003, 11:26 AM: Message Edited By: Brett ][/size]
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Old Jun 06, 2003, 10:16 AM   #3
jad2k1
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Default Re: Everybody Please Read...

geez. im with you jerry,if you dont like it ,ignore it.and if that guy cant do something that simple and bugs you like that-might as well remove him from the forum
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Old Jun 06, 2003, 10:25 AM   #4
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Default Re: Everybody Please Read...

If I read correctly, Genesis is taking action against unlawful use of Astrid's, Klaus's, and Jurgen's work on the page.

But anyway...good for you, Jerry. You had more patience and tolerance and I!

-lennon4
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Old Jun 06, 2003, 02:24 PM   #5
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Default Re: Everybody Please Read...

The discussion on the topic of this website has gone too far. As we speak, people are looking at the site. All we are doing is promoting the website. For those who are so outrageously opposed against it, don't waste your energy typing it.

Just ignore the site, this has been discussed on this forum for so many times already that I got sick just reading Jerry's post on it. Life is very short and there's no time for fussing and fighting my friends, said John. Let's just work it out and get on with our lives.
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Old Jun 06, 2003, 02:36 PM   #6
Johnna Lynn
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Default Re: Everybody Please Read...

Jerry was more than understanding with this person. He was not rude, as the Marharish or whatever his name is claimed. Jerry was firm and assertive. Why do people see stenghth of character as a threat? I say ingore this person from now on. Jerry gave him his 15 minutes.
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Old Jun 06, 2003, 02:42 PM   #7
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Default Re: Everybody Please Read...

I woulda been X-Rated towards MMY,sadly....boy,the REAL Maharishi would be proud of his namesake [img]graemlins/images/icons/rolleyes.gif[/img]

[size="1"][ Jun 06, 2003, 03:43 PM: Message Edited By: Tim ][/size]
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Old Jun 06, 2003, 02:54 PM   #8
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Default Re: Everybody Please Read...

Quote:
Originally Posted By HMVNipper:

I applaud you, Jerry, for being willing to link to controvercial and anti-Beatles sites as part of your links...I might not agree with the site, but I FIRMLY believe in the First Amendment and censorship sticks in my craw.
<font size="2" face="Tahoma, Arial, sans-serif">Exactly! Anyone with any common sense will be able to pick out the good stuff from the garbage. I seriously doubt that anyone on BLinks is going to turn anti-Semitic simply by reading that silly site's content! If people have any brains whatsoever, they'll disregard what's posted on that site and just GET ON with their lives. We live in a world that's far from perfect, and that garbage has existed for a long time and will probably always be around in some way, shape, or form--it's up to the smart person to ignore it.
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Old Jun 06, 2003, 03:02 PM   #9
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Default Re: Everybody Please Read...

Well guys,
I completely agree with you.
Personally I hate racists and nazis and all that
rubbish,but one said (don't remember who...)
'I'm not agree with things you're saying,but I could die to let you talk (even if it's bullshit.)
This is the basis of democracy.
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Old Jun 06, 2003, 05:00 PM   #10
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Default Re: Everybody Please Read...

I am sorry to disagree, but I am so saddened by all this. I am not the most articulate person in the world, so I cannot put my feelings on this to paper so well. "What I feel I can't say..."

I am so sad, that I can say.

I think Maharishi was very polite, and just conerned for the wellfare of other people. He had an opinion and the courage to state it which is more than I have most of the time. I love Maharishi~ he is one of the best friends I have ever had. He is ALWAYS kind to me. He is ALWAYS patient. He is the example of a consciousness raising, kind, loving, Krishna devotee. I cannot say enough good things about him, really.

I think he raises good points, awesome points. Obviously, the folks at Genesis think so too...they have called their lawyers. When Yoko follows suit, then what will we say?

George was called a nazi once by a newspaper, and it was a big deal to him...he filed a lawsuit and George HATES lawsuits. So, I think it is easy to extrapolate what his views would be on this.
He took the time and trouble to let people know he and hatred had nothing to do co-mingling.

Hope I don't get kicked out of Links, but I am saddened by people's lack of vision. We can talk ad nausium about Paul's henna hair dye, but you all lose patience when Maharishi has real political concerns?

I don't want to leave...but I will really, really miss Maharishi here. I see so much of the Beatles own values exercised in his writing, convictions, and life. He is always loving and positive, lighthearted, and kind. We all could have learned so much about life and love from his continued membership. To me, that is what life is about. I would rather be surrounded with love and light and Krishna, as I read in Maharishi's posts, than to defend some icky hate site's rights.

Sorry, Jerry, but that's how I feel.
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Old Jun 06, 2003, 05:17 PM   #11
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Oh...one more thing, for those who don't know...Dan definitely DOES have a life...he even works diligently for Greenpeace. His life is ALWAYS about increasing the positive on this twirling little planet we trod upon.

Like George, btw.
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Old Jun 06, 2003, 05:29 PM   #12
mccartneymaniac
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Default Re: Everybody Please Read...

maybe this person needs to get alife we take things way too seriously, and way too much out of context.lighten up please.
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Old Jun 06, 2003, 05:39 PM   #13
lennon4
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Default Re: Everybody Please Read...

Quote:
Originally Posted By Hari's Chick:
I don't want to leave...but I will really, really miss Maharishi here.
<font size="2" face="Tahoma, Arial, sans-serif">If you go back and read Jerry's post, you'll find that MMY asked several times to be deleted. It's his own choice not to come back. If you miss him, e-mail him.

-lennon4
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Old Jun 06, 2003, 06:06 PM   #14
Hari's Chick
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Default Re: Everybody Please Read...

Quote:
Originally Posted By mccartneymaniac:
maybe this person needs to get alife we take things way too seriously, and way too much out of context.lighten up please.
<font size="2" face="Tahoma, Arial, sans-serif">We all have things we take seriously and things to "lighten up" over, and how we each prioritize that depends on many things. "It's all up to what you value..."

So, telling someone to 'lighten up' is just to sound cool, IMHO. No offense.

George, when he spoke of complacency, liked to use this Dylan quote...

"Now, the wintertime is comin', the windows are filled with frost
I went to tell everybody but I could not get across
Well, I wanna be your lover, baby, I don't wanna be your boss
Don't say I never warned you when your train gets lost..."

Oh, yeah, Lennon4, Dan & I email all the time. But thanks for thinking of me, though. I know it was his decision. I meant I will miss reading his input specifically on Links. It is nice to have good buddies here. It makes the place much more fun.

[size="1"][ Jun 06, 2003, 07:09 PM: Message Edited By: Hari's Chick ][/size]
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Old Jun 06, 2003, 06:17 PM   #15
Johnna Lynn
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Default Re: Everybody Please Read...

Quote:
Originally Posted By lennon4:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Tahoma, Arial, sans-serif">Quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Tahoma, Arial, sans-serif">Originally Posted By Hari's Chick:
I don't want to leave...but I will really, really miss Maharishi here.
<font size="2" face="Tahoma, Arial, sans-serif">If you go back and read Jerry's post, you'll find that MMY asked several times to be deleted. It's his own choice not to come back. If you miss him, e-mail him.

-lennon4
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Tahoma, Arial, sans-serif">Hari's Chick; Why would Jerry censor you by asking you to leave the forum? That's what we are all talking about here. FREEDOM OF SPEECH Yes, Pauls hair was a silly topic to go on and on about. But it is now a running joke. I understand your wanting PEACE and LOVE. We cannot have peace without war, or love without indifference. NOT ON THIS PLANET!!!! * [img]graemlins/read.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/rotate.gif[/img]
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Old Jun 06, 2003, 09:32 PM   #16
old_moon_shining
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Default Re: Everybody Please Read...

This is Jerry's board so obviously he can do what he wants with it.

However, I must agree with Hari's Chick that Maharishi's approach was indeed extremely polite.

I have no axe to grind here, I am completely neutral. I am not a Krishna devotee, I am not Jewish and the people concerned are not particular friends of mine, though I have enjoyed many discussions with them.
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Old Jun 06, 2003, 10:02 PM   #17
RisingSun
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Default Re: Everybody Please Read...

I have spoken to Maharishi through email before and from those contacts and by just reading those emails that he sent, I think it's quite obvious that this guy is very polite. I don't think he did anything wrong at all. He has a life, he's a nice guy.

I don't post too often, so perhaps my opinion on another member means nothing to you and I should shut up, but I'm not going to. Daniel is a very nice guy, and he certainly does not need to "get a life."
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Old Jun 06, 2003, 10:03 PM   #18
joelcrowservo
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Default Re: Everybody Please Read...

I for one, would like to say that, as a bad hair advocate, I would call for an end to all derogatory comments about Mr. McCartneys hair.
Anyway...I agree to an extent, that Maharishi was very polite, yes. But Jerry tried and tried to explain his position, and the guy just wouldnt accept it. Its like when you tell a basically well-meaning child not to do something and why, and they don't listen. Appropriate steps have been taken against this 'website of hate', and it has nothing to do with Beatlelinks. I just wish we hadnt got caught up in all this.
I think Jerry has a lot of guts to go ahead and post this whole exchange, obviously unedited. It could have been swept under the carpet, but in the spirit of freedom, he laid it out for all to see. Thanks.
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Old Jun 06, 2003, 10:07 PM   #19
joelcrowservo
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Default Re: Everybody Please Read...

Quote:
Originally Posted By RisingSun:
I don't post too often, so perhaps my opinion on another member means nothing to you and I should shut up, but I'm not going to. Daniel is a very nice guy, and he certainly does not need to "get a life."
<font size="2" face="Tahoma, Arial, sans-serif">No, you are a member of this forum and your opinion does matter. Yes, the guy did seem nice, and its all really a shame. The thing is, this kind of thing can tear friends apart, especially on matters such as this. This whole issue could potentially cause irreperable damage to this friendly little forum, so everyone, please tread lightly here, and go with love in any case.
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Old Jun 06, 2003, 10:13 PM   #20
Johnna Lynn
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Default Re: Everybody Please Read...

Maharishi is polite util he realizes it will not change Jerry's mind. AN OBSERVATION. Free press shall reign. (Oh here I go.)People DIED so we could talk freely!!!!!! Dont piss THAT away. Its important work. Much more important than we know. I dont have the guts to put on a uniform and DIE FOR MY COUNTRY. I am in awe of those who do!!!! Thank GOD for America, may she coninue to be blessed with wisdom.
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