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Old Jan 22, 2006, 04:53 AM   #261
HMVNipper
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Believe it or not, nearly EVERYONE'S first fanfic is a Mary-Sue of some kind, lol!

I have said this before, though -- while some Mary-Sues are definitely awful and insufferable, a well-written piece with a decent character might qualify as one simply on the basis of being based upon the author, and yet is miles ahead of the average and can be an excellent story! I have read (and published!) many stories that might qualify as Mary-Sues to some people but are miles ahead in their literary form!

VersusBatman, if you haven't read any fanfic, check out my site, Rooftop Sessions (the link is in my signature), and go through the archives as well as the current issue. (Also read the Submission Guidelines -- you will see what I'm striving for with the site if you do.) There's also a fanfic directory out there (there's a topic about it in this forum) that has some stories that are not on my site listed. Please remember as you read, though, that there is a wide range of fanfics out there of varying quality -- so just be aware that even if you find a truly awful one, you are also just as likely to find really good ones, and don't give up after the first one you read. Read a variety of them in various genres to get a feel for what is out there.
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Old Jan 22, 2006, 12:58 PM   #262
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I'll have to check it out.

I've been reading and writing fanfic for some time and I've read good ones and ones that were not so good for sci-fi and comic books as well.
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Old Feb 19, 2006, 01:36 PM   #263
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Another thing that annoys me in fanfic, any kind for that matter, is character/person bashing. It totally takes away from the stories credability and makes the author look like a baby..... Also what astounds me is the lengths some people go to.....

I haven't yet seen this in beatles fan fic, but I'm sure its out there.


Anythoughts?
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Old Feb 19, 2006, 01:48 PM   #264
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Loony_leo
Another thing that annoys me in fanfic, any kind for that matter, is character/person bashing. It totally takes away from the stories credability and makes the author look like a baby..... Also what astounds me is the lengths some people go to.....

I haven't yet seen this in beatles fan fic, but I'm sure its out there.


Anythoughts?
If you mean bashing real people, it's out there all right -- I've seen plenty of stories (and rejected plenty too) that bash Yoko or Heather or Linda or Jane or Cynthia........

I just think it's disrecpectful, particularly if you're writing about real people, many of whom are still alive and could potentially read the story. Which is why I have a guideline about not permitting it in stories I accept.
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"When we blindly adopt a religion, a political system, a literary dogma, we become automatons. We cease to grow." - Anais Nin
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Old Feb 19, 2006, 02:26 PM   #265
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Amen, Sisters! Bashing and trashing people is cruel and counterproductive. We've had incidents at Links where some of the real people have been trashed. One former member who acted a fool on the Speedway on my watch made some very cruel, hateful comments about Heather and wished her harm. I deleted the posts; sent the person a PM about that sort of thing. They also made similar posts on Abbey Road and in time left Beatle Links.

I just hate that sort of thing - it makes me angry when a real person whom most of us don't even know is treated that way. I think it goes beyond disrespectful.
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Old Feb 20, 2006, 10:26 AM   #266
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HMVNipper
If you mean bashing real people, it's out there all right -- I've seen plenty of stories (and rejected plenty too) that bash Yoko or Heather or Linda or Jane or Cynthia........

I just think it's disrecpectful, particularly if you're writing about real people, many of whom are still alive and could potentially read the story. Which is why I have a guideline about not permitting it in stories I accept.
I agree. I've seen it out there, too, and it really does make the author look immature. Even if you're writing a story where John and Cynthia are in the process of splitting up, let's say, you can still create a dramatically-tense story without making Cyn look like a shrew.
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Old Feb 20, 2006, 08:13 PM   #267
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Amen, Sister! If there is one thing I just cannot stand, it is the bashing and trashing of real people. Cyn was most likely not a shrew and all the same, since we are working from our imaginations to create a strife filled conflict between John and Cynthia for literary purposes in fan fic, there is a way to keep it plausible.

As bad as the denouncing real people are, the praising on high and putting real people up on pedastals gets old fast. I can't stand fan fics wherein the Beatle in question is too good to be even remotely believable and the other characters drawn in equally black and white lines are cliche, trite and tiresome. Good fan fic shows people in a believable light, warts, wrinkles, foibles and all.
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Old Apr 14, 2006, 11:37 AM   #268
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beatlebangs1964

As bad as the denouncing real people are, the praising on high and putting real people up on pedastals gets old fast. I can't stand fan fics wherein the Beatle in question is too good to be even remotely believable and the other characters drawn in equally black and white lines are cliche, trite and tiresome. Good fan fic shows people in a believable light, warts, wrinkles, foibles and all.

I think the same can be said for regular books too!


Another thing that can be annoying in fanfic, is when the author is unrealistic. I once read a fic where John had a very Mary Sue girl friend just before and durring the time his marriage with Cynthia was desolving. Well in this fic the Mary Sue and John were naturally being hounded by the press and were getting fed up with it. The Mary Sue said something like "I wish they would back off" to which John replied "I know luv! We can run away together!"

I read this and thought. "Oh sure......John Lennon is gonna run away, he was only one of the most famous people at the time, how far is he gonna get? Not far!"
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Old Apr 14, 2006, 01:10 PM   #269
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Well, you never know, he could pull it off. He could just wear a hat and a fake mustache for the rest of his life.

I read one recently where two friends were trying out to be in a Beatles' music video (yep, you read that right.) One friend makes it based on her dancing skills; the other friend can't dance her way out of cardboard box, but Paul lets her be in the video anyway because she's just so darn pretty, she "deserves to be in front of a camera."

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Old Apr 14, 2006, 07:02 PM   #270
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MonaMe577
I read one recently where two friends were trying out to be in a Beatles' music video (yep, you read that right.) One friend makes it based on her dancing skills; the other friend can't dance her way out of cardboard box, but Paul lets her be in the video anyway because she's just so darn pretty, she "deserves to be in front of a camera."
Oh God, sounds like American Idol gone crazy. Blecch!
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Old Apr 15, 2006, 04:23 AM   #271
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Well....I guarantee that the piece of dreck you describe, Mona, would never pass muster for inclusion in Rooftop Sessions!

However...that said...I am not getting many submissions at all that pass muster. I have a few in the queue, but not enough to put together an issue without exhausting the supply. This is why there's been such a length of time between issues.

So...if any of you writers out there want to read better stuff on the net than angst-y, pornographic slash or anachronistic, implausible dreck....well...get writin'!
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"When we blindly adopt a religion, a political system, a literary dogma, we become automatons. We cease to grow." - Anais Nin
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Old Apr 15, 2006, 01:41 PM   #272
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As far as bad Beatlefic romances go, I once read the introduction to a story
(lost in cyberspace now) that talked about how John really loved Cynthia and married her for her and not just because she was "knocked up." The kicker: the last sentence went something like: "But I had to get rid of her to make this story work." That was so funny--of course he can't be married and run away with the girl! I don't remember very much of the story.
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Old Apr 15, 2006, 08:17 PM   #273
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MonaMe577
Well, you never know, he could pull it off. He could just wear a hat and a fake mustache for the rest of his life.
*snicker*

Quote:
Originally Posted by MonaMe577

I read one recently where two friends were trying out to be in a Beatles' music video (yep, you read that right.) One friend makes it based on her dancing skills; the other friend can't dance her way out of cardboard box, but Paul lets her be in the video anyway because she's just so darn pretty, she "deserves to be in front of a camera."

Rooftop Sessions, how I miss you...

Oh..... god that sounds terrible!
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Old Apr 17, 2006, 03:03 AM   #274
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Atrocious, even.

Leo, I don't like it when the author is also unrealistic - that Mary-Sue you described as cozying up to John does not sound like the kind of girl John would be able to relate to. I don't think John liked being the object of idolatry and I also don't think he enjoyed Mary-Sue girls, either. He did respect intelligence and from all accounts, people who stood up for themselves.

I know I do and as I've said oh, so many times the one thing that drives me stark staring up a tree is sycophantic behavior. Just because it's John doesn't mean Mary-Sue has to agree with everything he says, even if he were to say an eagle was a buzzard and a clock was a telephone. I hate the "yes-man, boot licking" syndrome and it is a behavior that I just cannot respect.
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Old Dec 05, 2007, 06:30 PM   #275
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I hate the bad spelling and grammar. Punctuation, too. Oh, and I also hate it when people make the character a whore! They have this girl kissing all four of them, sleeping with three of them, its crazy! Sometimes this goes on throughout the entire story. Its like, make a choice, seriously. I guess if she gets all four, she is probably also considered a Mary Sue, which is also pretty off-putting.
But thats just my opinion, some people might like it.
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Old Dec 05, 2007, 06:53 PM   #276
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XSomewhereXinXherXSmileX View Post
I hate the bad spelling and grammar. Punctuation, too. Oh, and I also hat it when people make the character a whore! They have this girl kissing all four of them, sleeping with three of them, its crazy! Sometimes this goes on throughout the entire story. Its like, make a choice, seriously. I guess if she gets all four, shes probably also a Mary Sue, which is also pretty off-putting.
But thats just my opinion, some people might like it.

Yeah I can't stand it when they are perfect enough to have all four of them head over heels for them! I mean its just not THAT realistic! Look at Yoko....John ADORED her, and the others were not all that keen on her to say the least...and I think I heard Linda went through something similar...

I don't know if I've ever come across a Mary Sue fanfic where when the Sue meets all the Beatles one of them cannot stand her. I think that would be fun to read...just to see the characterizations.

Plus it gets really tiring to read about the guys fighting over a woman its too cliched....makes me wanna vomit in my mouth a little..
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