1965 Christmas Message Outtake(?)

[EasternBird]

I just received the following link. It's an advertisement for a Beatles bootleg recording, but it contains a free 6-minute MP3 sample.

The sample appears to be an outtake of the Beatles' 1965 Christmas recording! As far as I know, it's never been released before. It's definitely worth a listen - amusing stuff! graemlins/laugh5.gif

Here's the link. Has anyone ever heard this before?
http://www.memorybankinc.com/rare_beatles.htm

[onosideboards]

yeah, i recently saw a link to that elsewhere. it's hilarious....some others were thinking it may be another spoof left over from kenny everett. i think it really is them, though may be taped conversation around the time of the butcher cover...which would explain the subject matter images/icons/wink.gif

or perhaps it was this little skit that inspired the butcher photo session? what's the story about the cover again...i know it's not the popular myth.

[Tim]

I'm not sure of A 1965 outtake but do have one from 1964.

From what I've always understood,the whole Sonambulent Adventure/Butcher sesion was Robert Whitaker's idea,

[paranoiac]

George mentions it's their third Christmas record, and it matches the kind of speech featured in the 1965 record, so that means that it's one of three takes recorded at 3 am on 9 November 1965 (just after the "Think For Yourself" vocal overdub session on the 8th).

[Edmund]

I hesitate to say this, but I don't think it's the Beatles.

First, Paul doesn't sound like Paul, and parts of John are not him, I'm almost certain. But I don't press this, as I haven't got a great ear for accents.

Second, the fooling around feels scripted. When the Beatles ad lib, and muck about, it's much more spontaneous-feeling than this tape.

Does anyone agree with me? Does anyone disagree ... if you do tell me what convinces you that it's the Beatles.

[Legs]

I haven't listened to it yet, will let you know what I think of it when I have. But on the official Xmas records, some things were scripted for them to, as for the voices, they also uses diferent accents talking with different sounding voices. But I will get back on this.

[Legs]

After listening I have my doubts to.Some of it sounds to much like a fake.but then again some pieces fit the oficial Xmas record.

[ Jun 06, 2003, 09:33 AM: Message Edited By: Legs ]

[paranoiac]

I've made my own comparison mp3s to prove that it is indeed their voices, PM me if you'd like to hear them. It *is* in fact their voices, it's just the tape is a little sped up.

[Edmund]

Originally Posted By paranoiac:
I've made my own comparison mp3s to prove that it is indeed their voices, PM me if you'd like to hear them. It *is* in fact their voices, it's just the tape is a little sped up.<font size="2" face="Tahoma, Arial, sans-serif">Tape speed would affect the pitch of the voices. It's the accent that sounds wrong, especially in Paul.
It sounds ... well, imitated!

[Edmund]

Originally Posted By Legs:
After listening I have my doubts to.Some of it sounds to much like a fake.but then again some pieces fit the oficial Xmas record.<font size="2" face="Tahoma, Arial, sans-serif">Yes, Legs, it sounds very real in places. It's just that if a part is faked, then it all is.

[paranoiac]

Tape speed would affect the pitch of the voices. It's the accent that sounds wrong, especially in Paul.
It sounds ... well, imitated![/QB]<font size="2" face="Tahoma, Arial, sans-serif">They're purposely putting on accents for the Christmas recordings. To quote the Beatles scholar/collector Bamiyan:
"I don't understand how anybody with ears could think this is not the Beatles.
It's hard enough to sound like somebody else for a sentence or two, let alone a
free-form 6-minutes speech, with laughter that sounds like the real thing. This
is clearly Paul, George, John and Ringo, not some impersonators.

And if it *were* fake, we should ask these guys to dub the Yellow Submarine
feature soundtrack all over again with 'real' Beatles voices!"

John Winn, author of "Way Beyond Compare", also addressed the 'accents':
"They're purposely putting on silly accents for the purpose of the Fan Club
skits. I don't have any doubts that it's them."

&gt;&gt;Anyway, it's no loss because it's all really dull stuff anyway. &gt;&gt;

"That much I agree with - between the recording of the "Think For Yourself"
vocal overdub session and these takes, it sounds like they were having a hard
time coming up with material for the Xmas disc, but were determined not to
follow the "thanks for being fans" pattern of the first two."

[Edmund]

You may be right, Paranoiac. But citing authorities means nothing in a debate like this. Remember, many experts though Peace Of Mind was Beatles, when it was bleeding obvious that it wasn't.

When I used the word "accent", I had in mind the Scouse "twang". I did not mean accent in the sense of "putting on voices". The Scouse twang is easy to imitate to an extent, but very hard to maintain. The fact that it gets lost frequently on this recording gives me doubts.

Lastly, I don't get a "free-form" vibe from this recording. That's another aspect that makes me doubt.

[Legs]

The baby part doesn't sound like them at all. Especially George and John.

[Tim]

I have to agree,I have doubts. Also,I'd think by now every second of tape that exists in Abbey Road has to have been booted....

[Legs]

I have the Ultimate Beatles Xmas Collection double set by Vigotone (o.k. mine is a cd-r copy but still)and at that time it was the most complete set of official and non official Xmas recordings the Beatles had done as a group and solo, and this isn't on it. The "Think For Yourself, beatles speach" is.
I don't know how long this outtake has been around and where it came from all of a sudden, the cd is a few years old, but I would think also that everything has been booted by now.

[ Jun 08, 2003, 05:56 AM: Message Edited By: Legs ]

[paranoiac]

{{{Also,I'd think by now every second of tape that exists in Abbey Road has to have been booted....}}}

Not true. Hundreds of hours exist in Abbey Road that remain unbootlegged. Just take a look through the "Beatles Recording Sessions" by Mark Lewisohn to get an idea. Early tapes like Please Please Me and With The Beatles were mostly destroyed (except for the bootlegged reels), but post-1964 tapes do exist.

{{{I have the Ultimate Beatles Xmas Collection double set by Vigotone (o.k. mine is a cd-r copy but still)and at that time it was the most complete set of official and non official Xmas recordings the Beatles had done as a group and solo, and this isn't on it. The "Think For Yourself, beatles speach" is.}}}

The Ultimate Beatles Christmas Collection was complete up until that point, but new outtakes surfaced recently on "The Seven Years Of Christmas" on one of the last releases by Yellow Dog. The "Think For Yourself" speech is not on the Vigotone Christmas set. Perhaps you're thinking of the Ultimate Collection by Yellow Dog.

{{{I don't know how long this outtake has been around and where it came from all of a sudden, the cd is a few years old, but I would think also that everything has been booted by now.}}}

The truth is, in addition to the studio tapes still in the Abbey Road vault, there are still unreleased/unbootlegged Lennon demos to be heard (Kenwood tapes), and I'm certain countless McCartney home demos from the Beatle period.

[Legs]

No question that there are still outtakes in the vaulths,but most of them are on boots.
As for Beatles Speach I made a slip up, I just meant to say that that was out on bootlegs also not on the Vigotone cd.

Is this take on The Seven Years Of Christmas by Yellow Dog? From the tracklist I asume that it's the official 3th Xmas record not an outtake.
And in fact I notice nothing new

Anyway can we have another pair of ears, cause that's all I go by, my pair of ears are saying the part from the baby butchering sounds like done by a Beatles cover band, who are trying their best to sound like the Beatles but are slipping up often.

[Tim]

It don't sound like them tht much. The only outtake I'e ever known about is the 1964 one.

[HariScruff_00]

This was a discussion (seems to have slowed down now) that was going at Beatlegs Yahoo Group, and I thought this post was interesting and maybe a little informative:

In a message dated 6/2/03 4:50:09 PM, ambrosia2@h... writes:

&lt;&lt; Why is this person selling these one disc at a time to anyone who finds
the website, he won't stand to profit very much, if it WAS real why doesn't he
aproach someone to try and make a package out of it? and realy make money? &gt;&gt;

Good questions. I wrote to the person selling the discs, and here's his reply:

--------------------------
Thanks for the inquiry about the recording. Apparently my friend, an
avid collector of rare music tracks was contacted by a person in Britain
who once upon a time worked in the studio of the Beatles. He wishes to
remain anomynous due to his involvement in the music industry to this
date. As a matter of a fact I am not privy to his name and simply own
the web site it is presently being sold on. Everything is at an arms
length but I like you believe it to be authentic. Did you access the
1st half of the recording at
http://www.memorybankinc.com/rare_beatles.htm
This might help clear up some of the doubt. The rest will only be
released on CD. My friend might be able to shed some light on the the
copy but I think it is only known as the 3rd Christmas recording and
because of the questionable material it was scrapped.
----------------------------

If you look on the link above there is also mention of "legal and financial considerations". I think they are trying to do this under the radar, and release the disc to everyone at once to avoid losing sales from people bootlegging or sharing the file. Of course, by that time Apple might have gotten wind of this and shut down their website, but at least we have half of it!

&gt;&gt;end&lt;&lt;

Personally, i'm torn. I don't really know what to think of it.

Maybe we'll never know its legitimacy.. images/icons/frown.gif
Anyone consider writing to Paul, Ringo, G Martin, or Lewisohn (after these CDs are released of course) and asking them if they remember... hmm?

[EasternBird]

Originally Posted By HariScruff_00:
Maybe we'll never know its legitimacy.. images/icons/frown.gif
<font size="2" face="Tahoma, Arial, sans-serif">Unfortunately, that's probably true. graemlins/images/icons/frown.gif

For what it's worth, I've listened to it several times now, and I still think it's real. It does sound like they're doing silly voices in parts (which Paul does a LOT on the "Beatle Speech" recording), but I still think it sounds like them. And how could that *not* be George? graemlins/smile1.gif

I hope it's real, though - it's fun to think that there are still some fun recordings in the vaults that we might get a chance to hear someday.