Vinyl Casualties -- promo or bootleg?

[Perderabo]

http://www.beatlescollection.com/Images/Large/DSC_1373-01.jpg
http://www.beatlescollection.com/Images/Large/DSC_1374-01.jpg

Some sources seem to say this is a promo. Others say it is a bootleg designed to appear legit. I have seen the album and it looks legit to me. Does anyone know for sure? If you have a definitive answer, please mention your source for the info. Thanks.

Aside: a google search did not help me, but it did turn up those beautiful photos. Yes I notice that site claims it to be a promo, but I don't recognize their authority in the matter. This is especially true considering that it is labeled "Yesterday and Today Promo". But I really love those photos and I decided to link them.

[Jerry]

It's definitely a bootleg, they just made it look like another 'Rarities' as much as they could. I got this on vinyl about 15 years ago I think. Here's more info...
http://www.bootlegzone.com/album.php?name=casualty

[62hofner]

Definitely a take-off on the U.S. Rarities! Looks kind'a cool, though.

Hey, Jerry... could you get this one up on the Premium site?

[Jerry]

Hmmm. I only have it on vinyl. But just quickly looking through the tracks, I'm sure they're spread around other bootlegs, or actually most of them are even official releases by now. This thing has gotta be about 15 years old, and it was really meant as another 'Rarities' LP. The date on the back says 1980, but I don't think it's that old, they were just copying every detail from the official release.

[62hofner]

Hmmm. I only have it on vinyl. But just quickly looking through the tracks, I'm sure they're spread around other bootlegs, or actually most of them are even official releases by now. This thing has gotta be about 15 years old, and it was really meant as another 'Rarities' LP. The date on the back says 1980, but I don't think it's that old, they were just copying every detail from the official release.

Ok, then!

[Serena]

i'll post it if you like....

[lennonluvr9]

I've actually never seen that before! It does look like a take-off of Rarities. I'm a bit confused about what exactly makes those songs casualties, but I guess they were just trying to find a name like Rarities...

[62hofner]

i'll post it if you like....

Hmmmm..... sure! If you want to post it, I'd be interested in checking it out.

Thanks.
:wave1:

[Perderabo]

I'm a bit confused about what exactly makes those songs casualties,

I have always assumed it was something like those tracks were the casualties of a bad decision to not release them in the US when they were first produced. That continues to have some truth while "rarities" is less and less true. The current incarnation is a 2 CD set called "Past Masters", and I am not at all fond of that choice for a title.

According to my notes, which may or may not be accurate...

Dec 1978 -- Blue Box set is released and it includes what is now called the UK Rarities (no other way to get Rarities)
Aug 1979 -- Collector's Items ((fake?) Capital Promo)
Oct 1979 -- Blue Box Rarities released in UK, but with black cover, as a separate LP
Mar 1980 -- US Rarities
Oct 1980 -- Casualties ((fake?) Capital Promo)
Mar 1988 -- Past Masters I and II CD's

I too have Casualties as MP3's. That's why I posted the question. I don't know if I should file it in my "promos" or my "bootlegs" directory. I still don't really. That bootlegzone link is describing one of the cd versions and I know they are all bootlegs. But what about the original vinyl? I do not see a bootlegzone entry for that. I was actually hoping someone could quote Mark Lewisohn or someone like that to get a truly definitive answer. That LP looks way too good to be a bootleg. If it is a bootleg, it is the highest quality bootleg LP I have ever seen. I have heard that Collectors Items is also very high quality, but I have never actually seen it. I'm not sure if it is promo or bootleg either. But that is moot since I have no MP3's of it to file.

Oh well, I will just combine my promo and bootleg directories. I don't have that many promos anyway.

[Jerry]

I'm 99% sure it's a bootleg. I remember exactly when I bought it, and who I bought it from. I have Collectors Items, and it's also a bootleg. I'm sure of it.

[Perderabo]

I now have the authoritative opinion that I had sought. For Christmas I got the book The Beatles Swan Song by Bruce Spizer. Bruce says (on page 174) that Collector's Items is "a clever bootleg fantasy piece". And he says "a followup fantasy piece hit the market in October 1980. It was titled Casualties....". So a noted expert says they are not legit promos.

A lot has been made of the fact that Collector's Items preceded Capital's Rarities, but there is a lot of overlap between the albums. Bruce points out that both projects were mining songs not released in the USA but that had been released elsewhere. That is a small set of possibilities and the overlap should not be a surprise.

.

[Beatleboy]

I was about to say that both "Casualties" and "Collector's Items" are 100% bootlegs, though they were both good fantasy pieces for the time. I also remember reading an interesting interview with the guy, who created both albums in a book I used to have.

The person (who chose to use a pseudonym for the interview, though I forget the name) told the author that he managed to obtain a high quality copy of the Butcher photo, and used it as the album cover. But he could have lifted that from "Rarities" considering that it came not long after, so who knows what really happened there.


I believe the book was titled "Bootleg" by Clinton Heylin that gives all of the details of how both "Collector's Item's" and "Casualties" came about. I'll have to see if I still have my copy, though it may have been lost in one of my moves.