patti's writing her memoirs

[instant karla]

Entertainment
News - Music, movie, Entertainment
BOYD SIGNS MILLION DOLLAR BOOK DEAL

Movie & Entertainment News provided by World Entertainment News Network (www.wenn.com)
2006-07-10 20:07:00 -

ERIC CLAPTON's ex-wife PATTI BOYD is following the legendary guitarist into writing after signing a lucrative $1.7 million (£950,000) book deal for her memoirs.
The 1960's style icon married Clapton in 1979 after her relationship with former BEATLE GEORGE HARRISON broke down, and inspired his classic hit LAYLA.
Now her amazing life story will be traced with the help of British royal PRINCE CHARLES' biographer PENNY JUNIOR, as part of a deal with publishers Hodder Headline.
Clapton announced his book deal last autumn (05).

[SF4-EVER]

Moving this to the Palace....

[beatlebangs1964]

When is the book due? This sounds like it would be very interesting.

[BeatlesFan4life]

This book does seem interesting.

[lennonluvr9]

yeah it does sound interesting. I'd kinda like to know when it's expected to be out too...

[Asha]

I'd like to read whatever she writes. I think it would be interesting. I look forward to this one!

[sadie]

It will be interesting i agree, and i don't think it will be sensationalist either.

[Asha]

I don't either. I'm thinking it will be more like I, Me, Mine where everyone thought it would be filled with all sort of personal info about certain things, & then won't! For example, she may talk very little about Beatlemania & more about modeling or something people weren't "hoping" for, if that makes sense.

[eppylover]

Oh my. I do hope she includes a lot more about Brian than Cynthia did.

Funny anecdotes. We've been told (by Derek Taylor, Alistair Taylor, Nat Weiss, etc.) that he lit up a room with his very dry and anarchistic sense of humour ~ but for some reason nobody has been kind enough to provide specific examples!

Also, I hope she treats us to a lot of pictures with Brian in them, She is a superb photographer, and I know she's taken some of him.

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f368/BrianEpstein/Brian%20with%20other%20people/w-pattie.jpg

[Siobhan]

Pattie and George stayed on very good terms up until his death, so I am sure it won't be sensationalist or scandalous. I read somewhere recently that Pattie is helping Eric write his autobiography, as are other friends, because he spent so many years in a wasted state he can't remember much of what happened, so maybe that's where she got the inspiration to write her own book.

[Marmalade Skies]

Can't wait!

[instant karla]

daily mail 21:26pm 14th July 2006

She has been silent for 40 years. Now tempted by a £1m pay cheque, the world's most famous rock chick is set to reveal every detail of her abusive marriage to Eric Clapton

Amid the amphitheatrical splendour of Verona’s Roman arena, Eric Clapton was not a happy man. On stage in front of 15,000 adoring fans at the lavish open-air venue this week, he was plagued by the draining summer heat and a particularly persistent mosquito.

"As he’s become older he gets miserable when it’s too hot," says a member of the 61-year-old rock star’s entourage. "He was bothered by the flies and his glasses kept steaming up." Clapton’s misery as he performed his classics Layla and Wonderful Tonight might also have been due, in part at least, to the woman about whom he wrote his two most famous love songs.

Holed up in her 17th-century cottage in the West Sussex countryside, Pattie Boyd, Clapton’s ex-wife and the woman he stole from Beatle George Harrison, is working feverishly on her autobiography.

The book, which will see Boyd finally break her 40-year self-imposed silence over her marriages to two of the biggest music stars of the 20th century, was described to the Mail by a publishing source this week as ‘full and frank’.

In other words, in exchange for her rumoured £950,000 advance, ex-model Pattie will be expected to dish the dirt about the sex, drugs and infidelities in her relationships with both the legends.

And to use the vernacular, 62-year-old Boyd certainly knows where the bodies are buried. Worse still for Clapton, her tome will go head-to-head in a sales war with his own forthcoming (and, it is rumoured, highly sanitised) £3.5 million life story. No wonder the guitar king is feeling the heat.

Pattie’s account of her life with Clapton is sure to tarnish his image as one of rock’s gentlemen. Particularly as, the Mail has learnt, she intends to lay bare the bizarre details of how the singer agreed to swop his own girlfriend for Pattie as a trade-off with George Harrison.

She is also said to be planning to tell the full story about dark rumours that during their nine-year marriage, Clapton, battling an addiction to drink and drugs, was an abusive and violent husband who cheated on her with a string of women because she couldn’t bear him children.

None of which is likely to make comfortable reading for the star — nicknamed Slowhand because of the speed of his hands on the guitar — who has become a father to three young daughters late in life thanks to his happy, five-year marriage to American-born former waitress Melia McEnery, 32 years his junior.

To compound his problems, Pattie’s memoirs come at the same time that another lover, Italian Lori Del Santo, whose four-year-old son with Clapton, Conor, died when he fell from a New York skyscraper, is penning her own version of events, which will allege that Clapton dispatched an aide to persuade her to have an abortion when he discovered she was pregnant.

Hardly surprising, then, that the veteran rocker, who is already worth £130 million, is said by associates to be rueing his decision to accept the payday offered by publishers Random House for his musings on his life and hugely successful career.

"He realises he has opened a can of worms with Pattie and Lori," a source close to him told the Mail this week. "He is not too concerned about Lori, but he never thought Pattie would reveal the secrets of their marriage.

"He comes out of it pretty badly, but the truth is he should have let sleeping dogs lie and never agreed to do this book. He knows he’s only got himself to blame." Indeed, friends of Pattie reveal she decided to sign her own publishing deal with Headline Books only because she was angry that Clapton had broken his vow not to speak about their marriage. Already, she has employed Prince Charles’s biographer Penny Junor to help her write it.

Meanwhile Clapton’s publishers are said to be furious over the news that Pattie’s book will go directly up against his own when they both hit the shelves in the autumn of next year. As one who has been researching their lives for several years for my own book on Clapton, I can say without hesitation that Pattie’s is one of rock’s great untold stories. Not only was she the muse for Clapton’s finest work, she inspired first husband George Harrison to pen the beautiful Something for her.

The public school-educated daughter of an RAF pilot, Pattie was a 20-year-old model when she was chosen to make a fleeting appearance in the 1964 Beatles film A Hard Day’s Night. The well-bred trophy girl caught the eye of bus driver’s son Harrison and the couple married in 1966. It was the blonde and toothy Pattie who spawned Harrison’s interest in eastern culture and introduced The Beatles to the Indian mystic the Maharishi Mahesh Yogi in 1968.

But it is her description of her relationship with another Beatle, John Lennon, that will be most fascinating. Rumours abound among those who surrounded the group that Lennon and Pattie enjoyed a brief fling during her marriage to George.

What is certainly true is that Lennon shared with his friend Mick Jagger a sexual obsession with Pattie, which he documented in a series of graphic diary entries.

Indeed, the blatant flirting between John and Pattie at a party at London’s Royal Lancaster Hotel in December 1968 led to singer Lulu stepping in to remonstrate on behalf of Lennon’s long-suffering wife Cynthia. Not that Harrison, despite his conversion to mysticism, was above the more earthly pleasures himself.

He enjoyed an affair with Ringo Starr’s wife Maureen Starkey during their marriage and his bed became familiar to a rotating band of groupies known as the ‘Apple Scruffs’ because they would hang around outside the group’s Apple Corps headquarters on London’s Savile Row.

But it was Pattie’s relationship with Clapton that was to wreck her marriage to George. She and Harrison met the guitarist, then with Sixties supergroup Cream, at a party in Chelsea in November 1968.

The two men became immediate best friends, but Clapton, who was living with his teenage girlfriend Alice Ormsby-Gore, the daughter of Lord Harlech, fell passionately for the lovely Pattie.

[instant karla]

When she rejected his entreaties for her to leave Harrison for him, he wrote the tortured love song Layla for her. Eventually, as George became more and more obsessed with the teachings of his new spiritual guru, Pattie fell into Eric’s arms. They continued their affair behind George’s back, even disappearing for trysts in an upstairs cupboard during candlelit games of hide and seek with an unsuspecting George at his huge Gothic mansion, Friar Park in Henley-on-Thames, Oxfordshire.

It was not Pattie’s first affair either. In the early Seventies, Harrison and guitarist Ronnie Wood, who would go on to join the Rolling Stones, negotiated a wife swop, with Pattie escorting Wood on holiday to the Bahamas while George took Ronnie’s then wife Krissy to his rented villa in Portugal.

Harrison finally twigged that Clapton had ‘done it’ with his wife when he arrived at a party at the home of his then manager Robert Stigwood in Stanmore, Middlesex, to see his best friend and Pattie acting like husband and wife. Clapton, who by then was living with model Cathy James, confessed his affair with Pattie to George and told him bluntly that he wanted her for himself. Harrison’s reaction was unexpected. He told Clapton: "Whatever you like, man." Then added: "You can have her and I’ll have your girlfriend."

Pattie fled in tears, but finally in 1974 she left George and moved into Clapton’s Italian-style villa Hurtwood Edge in the Surrey stockbroker belt. Astonishingly, the two men remained great friends.

But Clapton’s drinking and drug taking — not to mention his constant philandering — was soon taking its toll on his relationship with Pattie. By the time of their 1979 wedding in Tucson, Arizona, the guitarist was in the midst of a monumental addiction to cocaine. Just days before he asked her to marry him, he had begun a fling under Pattie’s nose with one of her best friends. She constantly forgave his affairs and his drinking sessions, which would start at 8am and last all day. But in 1982 she persuaded the star to check into the Hazelden Foundation drying-out clinic in Minnesota.

Part of his therapy was to read out a questionnaire filled out by Pattie which chronicled the abuse she suffered at his hands while he was in the grip of his addictions. Clapton was forced to admit to his fellow patients that he had beaten her up and forced her to have sex with him.

His behaviour led Pattie into her own battle with the bottle. Hardly surprising, then, that to this day she prefers to forget another song he wrote about her called The Shape You’re In, which chronicles her own alcoholism.

But it was Pattie’s inability to have children that proved the death knell for their marriage. Like Harrison before him, Clapton was keen to start a family, but despite fertility treatment she suffered a series of miscarriages. Meanwhile, Clapton began an affair with studio sound assistant Yvonne Kelly while recording in Montserrat in 1985, and she gave birth to his daughter Ruth.

Pattie was kept in the dark about the baby. But when beautiful television presenter Lori Del Santo, with whom he had begun a tempestuous affair, presented Clapton with a son, Conor, a year later, Pattie moved out. Clapton gave up drink for good, but the couple eventually divorced in 1988.

Pattie has consistently refused big money offers to tell her story about her relationships with the two rock stars, and remained on good terms with George until his death from cancer in 2001. Likewise, she stayed in touch with Clapton after their divorce and even attended the funeral of Conor in 1991.

But friends say she has never fully recovered from his treachery and went into psychotherapy in a bid to come to terms with the collapse of their marriage.

Nor, they say, was she ‘made for life’ by their divorce settlement and is wont to tell friends, who ask her how it feels to have been the inspiration for some of the most touching love songs of all time, that she would have preferred the royalties.

It is said only partly in jest and she maintains that she had to find a job after her split from Clapton.

Today, she makes a living from photography and currently has an exhibition in London of her shots of her showbusiness friends. She has never remarried and lives alone with her cat following her split last year from long-term lover Rod Weston, a property developer.

A friend explains: "Pattie always said that she would never write her book despite hundreds of offers and she always said she was very keen to protect George’s memory.

"But quite honestly she was very annoyed when she heard that Eric had decided to write his own book. Her publishers will, of course, love the fact that both their books, with their different recollections of the same events, will be coming out at the same time."

Christopher Simon Sykes, who is ghost-writing Clapton’s book, told the Mail: "It is always difficult when you get two people’s version of the same story. He is telling his story, Pattie is telling hers.

"I spoke to Pattie last month and she told me she is saving her own memories for her own book, but she didn’t tell me when it would be coming out. I suppose it will concentrate Eric’s mind."

He also admitted that Clapton has insisted on censoring his version of rock history. "Eric is not going to lay open his whole life," Sykes said. "There will be things he will keep private, because he says he doesn’t want his entire life laid bare to the public. He will choose what he doesn’t say himself.

"Eric and I are about half way through the book and haven’t really got to Pattie yet, but he is incredibly generous about her." Time will tell if Clapton feels so well disposed to his ex once he reads the no-holds-barred revelations of the woman he immortalised in song. In the meantime, just like during this week’s performance, he’ll have to keep sweating.

[instant karla]

sorry for the long post (but hey, i didn't write it!)

seems patti's book will be a tell-all after all.

[beatlebangs1964]

Or axes to grind. Still, it sounds interesting and I will certainly
read it once it goes to print.

[sadie]

The Daily Mail is a god awful right wing paper, i wouldn't believe anything they write.

[sourmilkpinky]

I will be interested to read it. I can not imagine her being vicious. Of course she isnt going to include what I really want to know either ;)......But I am glad she is going to write something.

[sadie]

and what would that be Shelly?

[sourmilkpinky]

if eric snores :P

[sadie]

yeah right.....of course.:teeth1:

[eppylover]

The Daily Mail is a god awful right wing paper, i wouldn't believe anything they write.So they're the British Press equivalent of Bill O'Reilly, I'd guess! That figures.

The Daily Mail, trying to stir up crap. How would THEY know if he's getting upset about it? Did they get into his head? :rolleyes:

Good chance, then, that it's not "revenge" ... So I'd take all the Clapton "stressing-out" text with a shaker of salt.
Who knows? Eric might have been cool enough and honest enough to give his blessing to Pattie to reveal naughty details.

Or *evil snicker* maybe she IS finally getting revenge on those damn MEN! :laugh5: We won't know until the book comes out.

As Lennon made perfectly clear to us, the Beatles were right bastards. But we love 'em anyway, because it comes with the territory:
The bigger the genius, the bigger the quirks. :heart2:

[Weeping Guitar]

The thing is with private lives is that they should be kept private. People, whether famous or not, have all slept with people they regret sleeping with, have all done things they know to be wrong, fallen in love with people they shouldn't have etc, but because the majority of us aren't in the public eye, we aren't judged, because people don't know our life stories.

Now as for what went on back then, and who slept with whom, it was the 1960's, in London. These were the Beautiful People. It was the era of free love. Young, talented, wealthy people having the time of their lives.

The circumstances and the morality of the times have to be taken into account. Society has become less open about sex, because of AIDS etc. Free love is now seen as irresponsible. Drugs are seen as stupid, and music . . . well what can I say? We're criticising and judging the pioneers of the modern music scene!

Come on guys! These people are supposed to be our heroes!!

[FPSHOT]

I tend to believe that this Daily Mail article has quite some fantasy in it.

I do not know Pattie, but what I have heard and read about her I can not imagine that she will write a nasty book about her life with George and Eric. There are quite some examples where her love for George is shown to still exist. I do not know about Eric though, their marriage I think was overshadowed by Eric's lifestyle maybe. Maybe not.

But whichever way, I tend not to believe the quotes by 'sources' and 'friends'. Like what the article says about George at the time Eric got involved with Pattie; I find that very non-realistic. George has expressed in many occasions how he reacted to their relation and his split up from Pattie and the way it is described by the Daily Mail now is to me just false.

Maybe it is best to wait for Pattie's book and not speculate based on these types of newspaper articles.

Yet, I do realise that they were no saints or pussycats, the wife swapping (LOL that is a quote) was not rare in the 60's I think...but ...I also believe that many celebrity journalists are known to have more imagination than Walt Disney.

[instant karla]

http://www.nypost.com/seven/04062007/gossip/pagesix/clapton_note_stole_layla_pagesix_.htm

April 6, 2007 -- THE inside story of how Eric Clapton sneakily stole his pal George Harrison's first wife, Pattie Boyd, has finally been revealed. In her upcoming autobiography, "Wonderful Tonight," Boyd, a former London model, says her 10-year storybook marriage to the beloved Beatle collapsed after she received an unexpected love note from Clapton. "One day, I got a letter in the mail. It was written on a piece of paper torn out of a copy of the novel 'Of Mice and Men,' " writes Boyd, the inspiration both for Harrison's most famous song, "Something," and for Clapton's "Layla." "In tiny, scrawly, little handwriting it said, 'Dear Pattie, I have always loved you and this is breaking my heart. All I want is to be with you.' So I showed it to George, who just dismissed it. Early that evening, the phone rang and it was Eric. He said, 'Did you get my letter?' " Boyd launched into an affair with the guitar great and eventually dumped Harrison to marry "Slowhand" in 1977. That marriage would last 11 years, and through it all Clapton remained friends with Harrison, up to the Beatle's untimely death in 2001.

[instant karla]

http://www.hodderheadline.co.uk/index.asp?url=bookdetails.asp&book=105720&best=


Wonderful Today: The Autobiography of Pattie Boyd

Pattie Boyd Penny Junor
ISBN 13: 9780755316427 ISBN 10: 0755316428
Publisher: Headline 23/8/2007
£20.00 RRP Hardback

Pattie Boyd was the Queen of the Sixties and beyond…a drop-dead gorgeous model, photographer, and the inspiration for the timeless songs Something, Layla and Wonderful Tonight. Her story is one of drama, struggle and, ultimately, affirmation, but her struggles `against addiction, tragedy, infertility` were lived with two of the twentieth century`s greatest musical icons: her husbands George Harrison and Eric Clapton.
Now, after 40 years, she tells her extraordinary story. From growing up in Kenya in a privileged but broken home, becoming a sixties supermodel, working with David Bailey and Ozzie Clarke, and meeting the Beatles, to marriage to George and then Eric, to the accidents and brushes with tragedy – her own and Eric`s – this is a mesmerising human story.
Written with the acclaimed biographer and journalist Penny Junor, WONDERFUL TODAY is rich and raw, it is funny, heartbreaking and heartwarming. Written with the acclaimed biographer and journalist Penny Junor, WONDERFUL TODAY is rich and raw, it is funny, heartbreaking and heartwarming

[FPSHOT]

Well if this is the "inside story" which this so called newsreport back then referred to it shows again how the media can act at times. I can not see anything nasty in this?

Thanks for posting.

[instant karla]

http://www.usatoday.com/life/books/news/2007-06-13-rocker-memoirs_N.htm

(this is just part of the article)

The memoir that could outsell all of them isn't written by a rocker. On Aug. 21, Harmony Books will publish Wonderful Tonight by Pattie Boyd, model and former wife of George Harrison and Eric Clapton. First printing: 500,000. Boyd inspired Harrison's Something and Clapton's Layla.

"She is Layla," says DeCurtis, "and she was at the center of one of the major romantic triangles in the history of rock 'n' roll. Absolutely she'll have an audience."

[eppylover]

*sigh*
The pathetic one-track-mind eppylover
still wonders how much Brian content is included
in this much-anticipated Pattie Boyd book. http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y253/courvoisierandcarbitral/misc/ani-rolleyes.gif

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b109/eppylover/th_MOA001_Brian_EPSTEIN_P.jpg (http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f368/BrianEpstein/Portraits/portrait-6.jpg) http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b109/eppylover/th_cowboyguitar-b-1415.jpg (http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b109/eppylover/cowboyguitar-b-1415.jpg) (click pics for much larger Brian-y goodness)

The pestering eppypromotional christine shall now leave y'all alone again for awhile...

[oldbeatlechick]

I have pre-ordered both "Wonderful Tonight" and "Wonderful Today" both by Pattie Boyd, from Amazon, both are out 24th August!! looking forward to a good read! :teeth1:

[eppylover]

I have pre-ordered both "Wonderful Tonight" and "Wonderful Today" both by Pattie Boyd, from Amazon, both are out 24th August!! looking forward to a good read! :teeth1:That rocks! http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y253/courvoisierandcarbitral/misc/rock.gifWheeee!

[beatlebangs1964]

I pre-ordered them as well. I admit that I will be very interested to see what she has to say.

[EnchantingLennon]

I preordered the American version, Wonderful Tonight. I'm sure there will be one day that I'll get Wonderful Today to see if there's any difference in the two books, like photographs or whatnot. I'm sure they will be the same, except if the paperback version comes out and edits some content out like what happened with Cynthia's book, John. I am looking forward to Pattie's book- it's something to look forward to over a boring nothing-special summer!

I don't really buy much into the Daily Mail...what's up with the sexual fascination between John and Pattie? Other then what happened at the 1967 Magical Mystery Tour party, I never heard anything else. I would guess that the Daily Mail are just trying to stir something up in the rumor mill. I will wait for what Pattie will have to say for herself of her relationship with George, Eric, John, Ringo, Cynthia, and Maureen especially about the bed-hopping experiences.

[eppylover]

I will wait for what Pattie will have to say for herself of her relationship with George, Eric, John, Ringo, Cynthia, and Maureen especially about the bed-hopping experiences.WHOA ~ Enchanting, aren't you the licentious little wench! Hahaa
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y253/courvoisierandcarbitral/misc/woohoo.gif

[EnchantingLennon]

WHOA ~ Enchanting, aren't you the licentious little wench! Hahaa
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y253/courvoisierandcarbitral/misc/woohoo.gif

Well it's true- Pattie's the better person to write about it, not the Daily Mail who wasn't there to witness any of it!

[eppylover]

I just wonder if our sweet Pattie will feel she's above mentioning very much of that sort of thing.

I'm sure there are many interesting Beatle memories she has ~ ones that don't relate to sex ~ that haven't been written about yet.

We shall see!

[beatlebangs1964]

The thing is with private lives is that they should be kept private. People, whether famous or not, have all slept with people they regret sleeping with, have all done things they know to be wrong, fallen in love with people they shouldn't have etc, but because the majority of us aren't in the public eye, we aren't judged, because people don't know our life stories.

Now as for what went on back then, and who slept with whom, it was the 1960's, in London. These were the Beautiful People. It was the era of free love. Young, talented, wealthy people having the time of their lives.

The circumstances and the morality of the times have to be taken into account. Society has become less open about sex, because of AIDS etc. Free love is now seen as irresponsible. Drugs are seen as stupid, and music . . . well what can I say? We're criticising and judging the pioneers of the modern music scene!

Come on guys! These people are supposed to be our heroes!!

Well put, Weepy and because we admire them does not give us the right to judge them. Most of us don't even know them personally, but that does not quell our interest.

Given the times and being young, rich and famous and having the world at your feet, it is only natural to indulge to excess; to push the envelope and enjoy as much of life's perks as possible.

I'm all for honoring privacy as well. In the case of public figures whom we admire, it is only natural that we would find them interesting and that they have had similiar or even vastly unusual life experiences is all the more to pique our collective interest.

There is nothing wrong with finding them interesting or enjoying books of this ilk (although Sadie/Sally, I agree with you about The Daily Mail - it is tabloid trash)! - it is, however important to keep in mind that we are reading about the lives of real people and it is best to reserve judgment and keep an open mind.

*edited in* I did a check on Amazon.com and the book is entitled "Wonderful Tonight" and no record exists of a title "Wonderful Today."

[instant karla]

Pattie Boyd: 'My hellish love triangle with George and Eric' - Part One
Last updated at 08:21am on 5th August 2007

(i'm not posting the excerpt here... it's long (in 2 parts), with lots of good pictures, and a video interview at the end.

here's the link to the article in its entirety:

http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/femail/article.html?in_article_id=473174&in_page_id=1879

[Hari's Chick]

When I met Pattie at her art exhibit she seemed like a lovely woman and even giggled to me girlishly taling about how attractive George was in the print I purchased. When George's name arose, her eyes welled with tears. During the entire exhibit, she played only Harrisongs... not a single Clapton song. Now she trashes on George and even stoops low enough to say EC is a better guitar player. *sigh*

I've entirely changed my opinion of Pattie, sadly.

My favorite parts are where Patti~

1. says she was not actually suicidal, but just in case picked out the fashion style/dress she would pick if she ever were suicidal

and

2. this line... "I was furious. I went straight out and dyed my hair red."

:rolleyes:

Poor George, no wonder he was lonesome in that marriage.

If any of what she asserts is even truth, I must say she and Eric look sadly like drama kings/queens. I found Eric's letters to Patti laughable and Patti gullable.

George, however, looks beautifully human. I understood his every emotion as depicted in the story. I understood his frustrations and reactions. Pattie was obviously not supportive of George spiritually. She bitterly recounts his meditation hours as times he was "obsessed" and "ignoring her". I wonder if she will include how she felt rejected when George decided for spiritual reasons to be celebate. Repeatedly in the exerpt she says George would deny her accusations and call her paranoid. It made me wonder how many of her accusations are bitter grapes for his self imposed celebacy.

[Hari's Chick]

By the way, I am not implying George was a saint. What I do think is that we have only one vague reference of a houseguest before EC sought involvement with Pattie. At that point, she says George felt all was fair, so to speak. Pattie repeatedly calls EC's drivel "exciting". Looked at carefully, a lot is revealed about Pattie herself.


Just my .02 cents.

[instant karla]

Pattie Boyd: George had to ask Brian Epstein for permission to marry me
By PATTIE BOYD - More by this author » Last updated at 10:34am on 5th August 2007

http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/articles/showbiz/showbiznews.html?in_article_id=473175&in_page_id=1773

[eppylover]

Pattie Boyd: George had to ask Brian Epstein for permission to marry me
By PATTIE BOYD - More by this author » Last updated at 10:34am on 5th August 2007

http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/articles/showbiz/showbiznews.html?in_article_id=473175&in_page_id=1773Thank you for this one, IK!

I'm grateful that Pattie explains to us the fact that clearing it with Eppy was necessary because their wedding date
might have conflicted with a tour schedule or something ~ not because he was a despot, as many others have hinted!

She obviously loved Bri and has nothing but glowing praise for him...at least in the excerpt there on the Mail's site.
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f368/BrianEpstein/Brian%20with%20other%20people/w-pattie.jpg

[beatlebangs1964]

Poor George, no wonder he was lonesome in that marriage.

If any of what she asserts is even truth, I must say she and Eric look sadly like drama kings/queens. I found Eric's letters to Patti laughable and Patti gullable.

George, however, looks beautifully human. I understood his every emotion as depicted in the story. I understood his frustrations and reactions. Pattie was obviously not supportive of George spiritually. She bitterly recounts his meditation hours as times he was "obsessed" and "ignoring her". I wonder if she will include how she felt rejected when George decided for spiritual reasons to be celebate. Repeatedly in the exerpt she says George would deny her accusations and call her paranoid. It made me wonder how many of her accusations are bitter grapes for his self imposed celebacy.

Dyeing her hair red was an interesting way of
expressing anger. Many people see red - she
colored her hair red.

I like what you said about how beautifully human
George looked - actually, I could understand both
sides of the story. Imagine being married to this
beautiful and talented man who wooed and "won"
you from another suitor. Imagine being on the
inside track of the world's greatest band, the
roller-coaster ride of being part of it, if even
from the background to a large extent. Now i
magine that your spouse is seeing other women
and how you don't feel included in his new interests.
You try to be supportive, but you don't share the
level of enthusiasm/interest...sort of like Paul's
1966 gem, "For No One." Your "Something" sours i
nto a sad refrain of "For No One."

Imagine being married to this beautiful and highly
talented person who has decided to be celibate
for part of his life for spiritual/religious reasons.
Now, if you want the full perks of the marriage
(and that does include loving intimacy), it is
understandable that you would feel maritally
bereft if such intimacy is not forthcoming.

I am not on anybody's side and I'm not
saying anybody here is. I am just trying to
view this objectively and be fair about it.

[FPSHOT]

When I met Pattie at her art exhibit she seemed like a lovely woman and even giggled to me girlishly taling about how attractive George was in the print I purchased. When George's name arose, her eyes welled with tears. During the entire exhibit, she played only Harrisongs... not a single Clapton song. Now she trashes on George and even stoops low enough to say EC is a better guitar player. *sigh*

I've entirely changed my opinion of Pattie, sadly.

My favorite parts are where Patti~

1. says she was not actually suicidal, but just in case picked out the fashion style/dress she would pick if she ever were suicidal

and

2. this line... "I was furious. I went straight out and dyed my hair red."

:rolleyes:

Poor George, no wonder he was lonesome in that marriage.

If any of what she asserts is even truth, I must say she and Eric look sadly like drama kings/queens. I found Eric's letters to Patti laughable and Patti gullable.

George, however, looks beautifully human. I understood his every emotion as depicted in the story. I understood his frustrations and reactions. Pattie was obviously not supportive of George spiritually. She bitterly recounts his meditation hours as times he was "obsessed" and "ignoring her". I wonder if she will include how she felt rejected when George decided for spiritual reasons to be celebate. Repeatedly in the exerpt she says George would deny her accusations and call her paranoid. It made me wonder how many of her accusations are bitter grapes for his self imposed celebacy.

Absolutely perfectly phrased. Also the additional post after this one.

The fact she did not try to understand George the way Olivia did and does is a pity, even more because she was with him in India and on top of the changes in is life. The fact she probably was looking the other way and now writes it down after all these years the way she does it...and even more...why she does it... deserves in my opinion not even a little piece of respect. That is, if you read her words thouroughly and know a bit about George.

[beatlebangs1964]

That was my impression too, FPSHOT...
part of what makes a relationship work
is sharing important parts of one ano-
ther's lives...moving and growing
together is an important part of
the success of any relationship.

I think now of John's song, "Grow
Old With Me."

I was under the impression that
Pattie did not try to understand
the deep significance of George's
core values and beliefs or try to
understand the inner metamor-
phosis he was going through
during that period, which I
think led to the dissolution of
their marriage.

On the other hand, it has been
said that Pattie was the one
who directed George toward
Eastern philosophies/religion...
still, she clearly did not follow
to the extent George did...just
a difference in interpretation,
and faith expression, perhaps?

More speculation on my part,
but in re George & Pattie, I
think a large part of their
relationship was based on
physical attraction - George
makes no denial of this in
accounts and in his own
words in re Pattie...

Olivia always sounded like
someone who shared George's
interests and beliefs whole-
heartedly; was someone he
could talk to and was plainly
his soulmate....just different.
Not better, but just different
and Pattie and Olivia came at
different points in George's
life. George in 1964 was
barely out of puberty and
George a decade later when
he met Olivia had matured
considerably and no doubt
had different expectations
about relationships when
he and Olivia met.

[FPSHOT]

There are certain parts in this article which are quite confusing. She is pointing the finger at George - in this section - whereas the name of Clapton passes by quite often to say the least. Now.. if George for instance was so nonchallant, then why would he come in to Robert Stigwood's party that way, walking in to the garden and ask "what's going on".. I mean... he must have had a reason for this whereas Clapper was a house guest and so if they were just 'friends' then George would not have come on that direct to them?

What she says about George wanting to be "some kind of Krishna figure" is just beyond any respect and also to me at least shows she had no clue what went on with George at the time... or it is just another way of putting George down and make her look like the hurt and innocent lonely wife.

She may have well called the book "Layla" because that is basically most of what she talks about... me me me hey world, I was Layla. She says "I have been asked for many years to write a book". I wonder by whom. She says a reason for writing it is that friends of her and 30 neeces and neffues don;t know much about her and certainly not her story. Well, they will be impressed for sure by all this? It seems like "Cleaning up time" where from George's side there is absolutely no reason I can think of.. however Clapton is working on a book so that may be the bad timing which indeed I read that the author and EC are furious about Pattie's timing and all the things she writes about Clapton. They also can be found with the same newspaper btw. The author of EC's book adds that sofar EC is very friendly about Pattie in the writing of the book.

Anyways...

It is what Hari's Chick says.. back then at the photo expo she seemed so friendly and so sweet about George and now... why why why and what will she gain from it apart from the 1 million pounds as I read somewhere... at least my sympathy for her is washed away.

[Hari's Chick]

What she says about George wanting to be "some kind of Krishna figure" is just beyond any respect and also to me at least shows she had no clue what went on with George at the time... or it is just another way of putting George down and make her look like the hurt and innocent lonely wife.


Very true, what it reveals is Pattie's ignorance and lack of understanding. What she says here is also a grave offense towards Krishna. She insinuates Krishna's gopis were "concubines"!!! She relates the relationship of Krishna and the gopis on the most mundane, profane level. It is a shocking .... terrible interpretation of Holy Scripture.

I will copy here one story of Krishna and the gopis to illustrate how the stories teach us how to live and what God's relationship is to us all. It has nothing to do with mundane levels, as Pattie assumes.



**********


Why krishna watched as gopis lifted water
18 Aug 2006, 0001 hrs IST,Shammi Paranjape
Print Save EMail Write to Editor


Once the gopikas of Vrindavan were lifting heavy pails of water, while their cowherd friend, Krishna, stood by and watched. He made no move to help them. The gopis marked His strange indifference.

However, a little later when they wanted to remove the pails from their heads and place them on the ground, Krishna rushed to help them. Asked why, He replied that His task was to help human souls unburden themselves, not assist them in adding burdens.

Often, we pray for the very things that God does not want to give us: added burdens. We seek fame, fortune and power but none of these give us the happi-ness we are seeking.

Why? Simply because all these are external and related to the world whereas true happiness is internal and related to the spirit.

We may strew our lives with pleasures, but that will not help because there is a vast difference between plea-sure and happiness. The former is related to the senses and is evanescent; the latter is of and from the soul and is abiding.

How to attain soul-abiding happiness? The scriptures have a stunning thing to say... they tell us that there is nothing to attain for we are sat-chit-ananda or embodiments of bliss, it is just a question of realising it.

The whole aim of life is this Self-realisation. To reach this one has to turn one's gaze and attention inward, away from the material world, to the inner essence of being.

"Whether one is a yogi or a bhogi; whether one is a sanyasi or householder, he alone will be truly happy and will verily enjoy, who is ever revealing inwardly in Brahmn", said Adi Sankara in the Bhaja Govindam.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/1902287.cms

[Hari's Chick]

By the way, bhoga is most often referred to as that which is offered to Krishna~ foods, flowers, offerings.

Here is also an explanation...

"What is bhoga? This is the sanskrit word for fun or pleasure. It should be an essential part of any yoga practice. This is a serious adventure in the sense that major transformations are possible but we should still have a great time while on the path."

So, "yogi's and bhogi's " ... I thought that should be explained...

[ringo_rama]

I remember, not even five years ago I read an article on Patti where she swore that she would never write a tell-all book, and that was one of the reasons why she was so respected by rock stars and remained friends with pretty much everyone she knew in the business.

Ridiculous.

[kmac]

All those years that have passed with Pattie taking the high road, respecting the privacy of past relations, giving Olivia room to grieve and reflect over the passing of her beloved husband, not embarrassing the family with stories that can no longer be refuted.

All of the good will that had been built has been destroyed, in a brief moment in time, at the hands of an obvious money-grab.

How do you sleep Patti?

[beatlebangs1964]

Very true, what it reveals is Pattie's ignorance and lack of understanding. What she says here is also a grave offense towards Krishna. She insinuates Krishna's gopis were "concubines"!!! She relates the relationship of Krishna and the gopis on the most mundane, profane level. It is a shocking .... terrible interpretation of Holy Scripture.

I will copy here one story of Krishna and the gopis to illustrate how the stories teach us how to live and what God's relationship is to us all. It has nothing to do with mundane levels, as Pattie assumes.



Thank you for that, Hari's Chick. I, too was very perturbed by these remarks from Pattie -- that is the equivalent of saying Jesus and His relationship with His Apostles was trivial and mundane, which rest assured it is NOT... for her to make such gross insinuations suggests two things to me: a) a lack of respect and appreciation for Krishna and the gopis and the faith in general and b) a lack of understanding and no concept of just how offensive such remarks are.

What really upsets me is the blasphemous tone some of these comments have - I didn't like it when she said George saw himself as a Krishna like figure. Yeah, it is true that I don't know any of these people personally. We get some sense of them based on what we have heard and read about them. Hari's Chick, you met Pattie and I am sure you feel quite hurt and devastated and betrayed by her remarks after she was friendly at the Art Show in San Francisco.

One of the many reasons I love George is that he brought God into his music -- it is George's humility and his willingness to give his talent to God that I feel made him even more special.

God and the Lord Jesus Christ are mentioned in many of George's songs. "Dear One," which is one of my personal favorites is a beautiful prayer set to music. I have said many times that my church, the Catholic church uses George's music for our prayer meetings and our discussion groups. I think George has helped bring many people closer to God through his music and I will always love him for that.

[FPSHOT]

Well said.

Well this is about Pattie and her writings and I think looking at the reactions here already, the book will cause a lot of sad reactions towards Pattie.

ringo rama - I recall that interview but can't find it. What I did find is her saying this in 2005

"Boyd was also a muse to Harrison and Clapton. Harrison wrote "Something" about her, among other songs; Clapton wrote the fiery "Layla" (its title inspired by an Iranian tale of obsessive love) about her, and later "Wonderful Tonight."
She's modest about being the subject of so many well-known songs.

Much of Clapton's work on the Derek and the Dominos record "Layla and Other Assorted Love Songs" was inspired by his passion for Boyd.

"All I can say is I feel deeply flattered and honored. ... I don't know what else to say. I guess I'm really lucky."

that's it.

Well I wish she had stuck with that and just had continued her silence and to tell more about her to her friends and family just had organised a nice day out with all of them and take a mike and start talking...privately... and I wonder if she would dare to say all these things in public. It actually does more harm to her I think than to the Harrisons because they have such a deep spiritual belief and whatever they will pick up from this book...Olivia and Dhani... they will take it as George had taken it I think... probably since they are close to Clapton it will come across maybe in conversations but I feel they will feel sorry for her. At least I hope that is what comes from it and let's hope the press does not jump on it the wrong way.

[FPSHOT]

Very true, what it reveals is Pattie's ignorance and lack of understanding. What she says here is also a grave offense towards Krishna. She insinuates Krishna's gopis were "concubines"!!! She relates the relationship of Krishna and the gopis on the most mundane, profane level. It is a shocking .... terrible interpretation of Holy Scripture.


oh yes I agree 100% and you say it very well... she just lacks understanding totally and from her that is just purly embarrassing as well as offensive?

That copied story of Krishna and the gopis is beautiful, thank you so much... it is wnderful to read and learn.

[FPSHOT]

Well George did write a song about Pattie which fits a bit to the stories in the Daily Mail

There goes our lady
With a "you know who"
I hope she's happy
And "old 'Clapper' too"
We had good rhythm
(and a little slide)
Then she stepped in
Did me a favour
I threw them both out.

We all can (see) so clearly
They see that our lady
Is out on a 'spree'

[Hari's Chick]

All those years that have passed with Pattie taking the high road, respecting the privacy of past relations, giving Olivia room to grieve and reflect over the passing of her beloved husband, not embarrassing the family with stories that can no longer be refuted.

All of the good will that had been built has been destroyed, in a brief moment in time, at the hands of an obvious money-grab.

How do you sleep Patti?


Exactly! Did Pattie ever once think how this will affect Dhani? No, she did not even care.... those dollar signs were sparkling too brightly. :sad1:

[Hari's Chick]

Well George did write a song about Pattie which fits a bit to the stories in the Daily Mail

There goes our lady
With a "you know who"
I hope she's happy
And "old 'Clapper' too"
We had good rhythm
(and a little slide)
Then she stepped in
Did me a favour
I threw them both out.

We all can (see) so clearly
They see that our lady
Is out on a 'spree'

Lovin' it!!!

Why did this song cross my mind this morning....

lC8fRRCCDWc

[Georgie Girl]

Is the book out now, or are there just "excerpts?"

[Hari's Chick]

Right now it is excerpts... I wonder if the Harrison's will make a statement of some kind? Or if they just will ignore it all?

[beatlebangs1964]

I would be surprised if Olivia or Dhani were to
say anything about the book...perhaps they
hope it will all just blow away.

[erinluv182]

I definitely don't know Patti, but almost everything I've heard about her has been positive. I think if she can manage to write a book like Cynthia's John, then she'll be in good shape. Cyn manage to spill the beans about John, but still do it in a way that communicates love and respect for him. I think most Beatles fans already know about George's fling with Maureen, and we definitely know that George wasn't faithful to her, so why shouldn't Patti be allowed to tell her side of the story? If people are somehow shocked or offended at what went down in her and George's relationship, then I would say that they probably didn't know too much Beatles info to begin with. I doubt Patti could say something that would make me think less of George.

I am definitely looking forward to her book coming out, and I will rush out to get it!

[instant karla]

If people are somehow shocked or offended at what went down in her and George's relationship, then I would say that they probably didn't know too much Beatles info to begin with. I doubt Patti could say something that would make me think less of George.

i agree with you, erinluv.

and let's not let idol-worship get in the way of reality. none of the beatles qualify for sainthood.

[Hari's Chick]

I am glad to see this getting discussion, even if I disagree with the content. I think the topic is worthy of discussion.


Yes, we know George was not a Saint... however it is also a question of ethics. George wrote "I, Me, Mine" and never mentioned details of any sort of the private things within their marriage to the general public. That was George being a gentleman. I only wish Pattie showed as much respect.

Yes, George was a public figure, though a reluctant one. That does not give Pattie the right to spill his life to the world as if it is owed. For example... I am reading a book called "Eat, Love, Pray" currently. It is about one woman's travels through Italy, India, and Indonesia in search of deep meaning in life. The book begins with her expressing deep feelings about the state of her marriage. That prompts her to leave the marriage, seek divorce, and set out on her personal journey. She explains her feelings about her marriage.... how she felt alone, etc. etc... yet she says she will give no details because that is not a spiritual thing to do. That what happened between her and her husband was a catalyst and further information is Gossip....

You know... Devils Radio...

I cannot think of one spiritual path which would condone her behavior, but correct me if I am wrong. George did not smear her... so she certainly has nothing fm his side to "correct publically". He even took the 'blame' for their not having children, telling others it was his biological issue which made it so they could not. Again, George "spared" Pattie.

Now, EC's biographer has said his book up to this point has been very respectful of Pattie. But Pattie felt she needed to "get there first" and smear EC. She has also placed him in a bad position, not that I particularly care about him. I dislike him as a person basically. Nonetheless, it seems like an ugly show of character on Pattie's part. She is a shallow woman, incapable of loyalty. Loyalty of character is more important than the loyalties which were broken by all of them in the Swinging Sixties. Those were loyalties of s physical sort. Loyalties of an emotional/spiritual sort should not be broken publically. If she needed to vent, get a confidant.

As I say, that is opinion... and I have so many on this... enough to write my own book... But I hope everyone feels free to express other, conflicting opinions. Discussion is good.

[Hari's Chick]

Oh one more thought... though George was no saint 'back when'... in the Vaisnava faith, he is believed to be a Pure Soul now, as he passed over chanting the Holy Names. As such, we believe he went straight to Krishna... into Krishna's highest abode. Devotees can even have George's photo, because of this, next to Prabhupada, Chaitania, and Krishna on their home alters. He is considered Pure.

As such, what Pattie does ... is considered a grave offense against God.

George asked Prabhupada to shave up and join ISKCON. Prabhupada said he was reaching more people for Krishna in the work he was doing with his music. George's musical prayers are played every morning at every ISKCON temple at 4:30 am... the first prayer offered to Krishna every single day worldwide. When one devotee asked Prabhupada "how can this be, he never even shaved up adn was initiated..." Prabupada said,"It is because George is more than a devotee." That is a HUGE statement.

When George passed their was a huge spiritual effect on the planet. I saw it. Many devotees renewed their commitments to chanting, and devotional service. Many his age suddenly ...not only mourned George, the Beatle, but mourned george the Godbrother. It revived their spirit and resolve to reach Krishna. George's passing had a beautiful spiritual effect on the planet. SO much love poured out and what was important- finding God/Spirit/Krishna/Jesus was talked about a great great deal.

Now...Pattie appears to me like a shallow groupie...excuse me it is how I feel... wanting to discuss how he was in bed. She attempts to reduce him to mundane levels. She is like a serpant in my eyes.

I would like to forgive her. Another reason I hope some other views can sofen my heart. But I am just very angry with Pattie.

[Rellevart]

I'm not sure if it is something I would read or not at this point. In a way, I like to read all sorts of points of view on the people I admire, both positive and negative, to make them more "real people" to me, more dimensional, more interesting. Yet, if something is obviously bashing, it angers me and I don't enjoy reading it. I'm not quite sure which side of the line it looks like this book will lie on.

Different people are comfortable with different levels of exposing their personal lives to the public and that's fine. It gets complicated when you're exposing your personal life in conjunction with another person, particularly one who's no longer with us, because at that point it's not just about you anymore.

However, it is her life and her story to tell if she chooses to tell it. It is all of our choices as to whether we want to read it or not. Some of us may think less of her for writing it, some may not. I'm not sure yet.

[kmac]

I support Patties right to publish whatever she wishes, after all many lives have been lost defending these inalienable rights. However, I had hoped that she would have not been lured into the temptation to denigrate the deceased, especially since she has respectfully avoided lucrative temptations to tell-all in the past.

The tabloid mentality, in my humble opinion, has evolved into a very harmful global obsession, sometimes even destroying human lives. Seeking monetary enrichment from the exposure of private human and celebrity foibles that do not have the consent of all parties, does not sit well with me.

I support the right of others to choose their preferred commerce, but I will not continue to feed the destructive tabloid and tell-all machine. I respect and support privacy when it is reasonable to do so.

Besides, if I want to have a good laugh, I don't have to look much further than the ridiculous things I have done in my life. That's for another day and a few beers. :beer2:

[beatlebangs1964]

I definitely don't know Patti, but almost everything I've heard about her has been positive. I think if she can manage to write a book like Cynthia's John, then she'll be in good shape. Cyn manage to spill the beans about John, but still do it in a way that communicates love and respect for him. I think most Beatles fans already know about George's fling with Maureen, and we definitely know that George wasn't faithful to her, so why shouldn't Patti be allowed to tell her side of the story? If people are somehow shocked or offended at what went down in her and George's relationship, then I would say that they probably didn't know too much Beatles info to begin with. I doubt Patti could say something that would make me think less of George.

I am definitely looking forward to her book coming out, and I will rush out to get it!

Well said, Erin. I don't know Pattie personally and it is not my place to judge her.

George was human and despite his human foibles and
failings, he was a good human being and regardless of
waht Pattie may have written, I seriously doubt I'd
ever think less of George.

Cyn did write an excellent book about John as did
John's sister, Julia. Never once did either speak of
John in a diserspectful or tawdry fashion, never once
did either exploit John's memory or deify him or deni-
grate him. They were honest portayals of a human
being as only a former wife and a sibling could have
possibly known him. Cyn has class.

Hari's Chick, once again you speak pearls of wisdom.
I'd like to thank you for your compassionate, good
comments.


Oh one more thought... though George was no saint 'back when'... in the Vaisnava faith, he is believed to be a Pure Soul now, as he passed over chanting the Holy Names. As such, we believe he went straight to Krishna... into Krishna's highest abode. Devotees can even have George's photo, because of this, next to Prabhupada, Chaitania, and Krishna on their home alters. He is considered Pure.

As such, what Pattie does ... is considered a grave offense against God.

I like that - excellent point. We all know George was baptized into Catholicism as an infant. The tenets expressed above are not too different from those of the Catholic faith...Scripture dictates avoiding gossip, Devil's Radio if you will.

George died chanting the Names of the Lord and he had Jesus in his heart....it is indeed the beautiful musical prayers George wrote that are used in my church for prayer meetings and discussion groups. In fact, there is a passage in Scripture about how God uses the signs and symbols of the times to get through to people.

One of the area church choirs sing "Here Comes the Son" - same song, only "Son" instead of "Sun" because the song is being sung to and about Jesus.

[Hari's Chick]

BB, that is beautiful... :)

I was re-reading a remark from George this morning. It was because of Elvis' anniversary. George is speaking about how he goes to meet Elvis after a concert in 1972. Though they are on very different sides of the sociopolitical fences, Elvis confided that he saw George differently than as 'just a Beatle'... that George, like Elvis, was a seeker of God. That is why Elvis looked forward/allowed a meeting with George.

So, George remarks in his way that he arrives in his "uniform"- jeans jacket and jeans, mustache and beard, hair way down his back... and he says he felt so small ... like a "grubby little slug"... and Elvis was like Lord Shiva.

Same scenario, now, but pretend he is confiding this feeling to Pattie. Fast forward, 2007, Pattie sits in her mansion looking for a few pounds to be able to get the face lift or so from the surgeon she wants...but now... what George said makes not such a good story. So.. it needs a little creative licensing. Instead, oh and without "lying"... Pattie beings to type away...

"George once confided in me how he felt dreadful about his appearance. He would get into deep depressions wher he felt he looked even molluscular... His delusions soon began to effect me. I imagined I was also a mollusk and found myself constantly self conscious I would smear the sidewalks..."

next chapter, perhaps...

"George fantasized Elvis was Lord Shiva. He was so obsessed with religion he would envision such things. As his friends would come over I would worry George may mistake Ravi for Gandhi... or perhaps Robert Plant as the Buddha. You never knew what would enter his spiritually obsessed mind next."


Journalistic license. So George hears perhaps a story of Krishna and the gopis and makes an little personal, private off color joke to Pattie... "hey, what say we invite a group of girl into the house and play gopi this afternoon?...Nudge nudge, wink wink, say no more..." Fast forward to 2007. George is not in his physical body... he cannot refute. So Pattie stretches that truth, that humor, that adorable George light heartedness .... into a pathological tendency.. Why? Because it sells.

My humble opinion and thoughts only.

[beatlebangs1964]

If that is the case, then that is very sad. I would have expected better from Pattie that something like this.

When George died, Pattie said that she would always love George.

In fairness, I will reserve judgment until I read the book. I confess that I pre-ordered it online.

[Hari's Chick]

If that is the case, then that is very sad. I would have expected better from Pattie that something like this.

When George died, Pattie said that she would always love George.

In fairness, I will reserve judgment until I read the book. I confess that I pre-ordered it online.

I completerly understand. I wish the book would change my feelings because I want to like Pattie. The excerpts unfortunately have been enough to make me lose faith in her. :sad1:

If someone wrote a nasty book, any book, on someone I loved... a close friend for example... I would want to read that, too. If nothing else it is good to be prepared in case someone someday says, "Oh, I read that he...." At least it does not come then from out of the blue. So I understand wanting to read it. By the way, so long as the spine is not creased, anyone who wishes may return it at any point for store credit or (with receipt) for cash... including after it is read. In normal chains that is a 30 day policy. :teeth1:

The hard part is that my fabrications above are obvious. I am sure hers will be more subtle, which just makes them more dangeous, imho. The example I took about the gopis and Krishna was an actual example, from the excerpts.

[beatlebangs1964]

Subtle untruths are the most dangerous kind...they plant seeds of doubt in the minds of others and distort reality at the subject's disadvantage...devil's radio, if you will.

I do look forward to reading the book out of interest and I will reserve judgment until I do. Still, these excerpts sound rather mean spirited...I am still holding out hope that I am wrong about this.

[Asha]

Yes, George was a public figure, though a reluctant one. That does not give Pattie the right to spill his life to the world as if it is owed.

Unfortunately it's up to each individual to do whatever they choose with the information they have. I've been around enough famous people to know that if they don't share the info with the general public, or if they're private about their personal lives, then they probably don't want that info out. I respect that & keep my mouth shut. But that's just how I feel. I have made some promises to public people & never told what they've shared if they've asked me not to share. So yes, I'm hoping Pattie isn't giving too much away.

But while we know George was private, it doesn't stop people from sharing information. We fans here on Links don't even stop talking. We love to grab any bit of gossip & speculate up the yazoo. I'm sure Pattie isn't telling everything, but if we fans can't even stop talking about George's private life, how can we be upset with others who talk about it? :nono3:

[beatlebangs1964]

Asha, you raise good points.

George was a reluctant public figure and although he was reluctant, that does not stop us or others from being interested in him and his life. I do hope that Pattie will be respectful of George as a person in her book.

I've only known a few famous people and I have not disclosed things that were shared in private. To me that is unethical and not in keeping with that person's interests...I would not feel right about that.

You are right, Asha, we are always sharing and talking about the Beatles and those closest to them all over the internet. Even so, I would never disclose anything that someone, famous or not said in a private context. It is one thing to pass out publicly related information. It is an entirely different matter to betray confidences by disclosing private matters.

[PepperlandFrog]

I completerly understand. I wish the book would change my feelings because I want to like Pattie. The excerpts unfortunately have been enough to make me lose faith in her. :sad1:

If someone wrote a nasty book, any book, on someone I loved... a close friend for example... I would want to read that, too. If nothing else it is good to be prepared in case someone someday says, "Oh, I read that he...." At least it does not come then from out of the blue. So I understand wanting to read it. By the way, so long as the spine is not creased, anyone who wishes may return it at any point for store credit or (with receipt) for cash... including after it is read. In normal chains that is a 30 day policy. :teeth1:Thanks for the advice. As for the other could you point me to some of these excerpts? If they are really really bad or just provocative i want to see them. If Patti truly feels like some of the men in her life just used her for her body, and not her spirit or her mind, then doesn't she have the right to a public airing, to let the demons loose, to tell her side of the story? If nothing else that would prove that she has nothing to hide. If this has already been covered then i apologize.

[Hari's Chick]

Thanks for the advice. As for the other could you point me to some of these excerpts? If they are really really bad or just provocative i want to see them. If Patti truly feels like some of the men in her life just used her for her body, and not her spirit or her mind, then doesn't she have the right to a public airing, to let the demons loose, to tell her side of the story? If nothing else that would prove that she has nothing to hide. If this has already been covered then i apologize.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/femail/article.html?in_article_id=473174&in_page_id=1879

I don't think this has been brought up before, Frog. Here is the link for you.

[Hari's Chick]

You are right, Asha, we are always sharing and talking about the Beatles and those closest to them all over the internet. Even so, I would never disclose anything that someone, famous or not said in a private context. It is one thing to pass out publicly related information. It is an entirely different matter to betray confidences by disclosing private matters.

Yeah, BB, that is exactly how I feel, too. It does not matter at all to me if someone is famous. People are people. I'd think George deserved the same respect no matter which job he may have.

[PepperlandFrog]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/femail/article.html?in_article_id=473174&in_page_id=1879

I don't think this has been brought up before, Frog. Here is the link for you.Thank you Hari's Chick. It's necessary to examine this in a proper fashion, if nothing else.

[beatlebangs1964]

People are people, Hari's Chick and George himself even admitted that he found it hard to believe that people were putting their faith in rock stars. George was a very humble man...part of the reason my church loves him is because he a) dedicated his talent to God and b) brought people closer to God via his music and c) he wrote these beautiful prayers that have touched many hearts and he never compromised his style for any reason. Those are just some of the reasons I love George...yes, he did deserve the same respect as any human being does.

[Asha]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/femail/article.html?in_article_id=473174&in_page_id=1879


Thanks for the link, HC! :teeth1:

Sounds like Pattie is sincere in what she's saying &, at least to me, she doesn't sound as though she's trying to spill trash about Eric or George. I think she's trying to be honest about what she remembers about her experiences. She mentioned that she wanted her friends & family to know the truth, so in many ways, I wish she would've just shared the info with them & not released it publicly. But who knows... maybe the general public has asked her so much, she feels the need to answer some questions?

So far she hasn't really said anything we didn't really already know, has she? I hope you all know what I'm saying. I sort of wish she wasn't doing it & left it as it were. But maybe Eric & George would've been ok with it? We just can't ask George, can we?

Based on the link HC shared, it sounds like she is hoping to deter some from getting into drugs (which had to make things very difficult for her & her relationships with anyone). This could be a good thing in that respect.

[Asha]

Asha, you raise good points.

George was a reluctant public figure and although he was reluctant, that does not stop us or others from being interested in him and his life. I do hope that Pattie will be respectful of George as a person in her book.

I've only known a few famous people and I have not disclosed things that were shared in private. To me that is unethical and not in keeping with that person's interests...I would not feel right about that.

You are right, Asha, we are always sharing and talking about the Beatles and those closest to them all over the internet. Even so, I would never disclose anything that someone, famous or not said in a private context. It is one thing to pass out publicly related information. It is an entirely different matter to betray confidences by disclosing private matters.

Right, BB. George was private. We all know that. & yes, if someone asks us not to repeat something, then obviously we wouldn't share it. That makes sense. But if you've never talked to George personally & he's never had the chance to tell you not to talk about his private life, does that mean we should go ahead & do it? I mean, logically, we can see that he was private, so just because he doesn't personally ask us not to talk about his family & his private life, we should still be able to make the decision on what to talk about & what not to, shouldn't we? However, this isn't always the case.

& I'm in total agreement! This isn't just for George or someone famous. The "rule" applies to every human being. We should all be courteous & respectful of each other. :teeth1:

[Lynner]

& I'm in total agreement! This isn't just for George or someone famous. The "rule" applies to every human being. We should all be courteous & respectful of each other. :teeth1:
A nice thought, to be sure, but I think most people talk/speculate about others, famous or not.

I'm interested in reading what Patti has to say because I love reading about life if the 60's.

Whatever Patti has to say about George (and Eric, too) won't change the way I feel about them. My opinion has been firmly formed about George for many years. :smile1:

[Georgie Girl]

A nice thought, to be sure, but I think most people talk/speculate about others, famous or not.

I'm interested in reading what Patti has to say because I love reading about life if the 60's.

Whatever Patti has to say about George (and Eric, too) won't change the way I feel about them. My opinion has been firmly formed about George for many years. :smile1:
Mine, too, Lynn, and the excerpts I've read haven't exactly shocked me. I am hoping that the book overall has a balanced picture of everyone, and I am still looking forward to reading it. It's all so long ago now and they had all changed so much since then. They were all still friends by the end of George's life so evidently any negative feelings had long since gone away. The guys had a thing or two to say about the things that happened between them all, now it's Pattie's turn.

I recall reading some of George's own quotes in the Anthology and thinking, "Too much information, George!" :laugh5:

[Hari's Chick]

A nice thought, to be sure, but I think most people talk/speculate about others, famous or not.

I'm interested in reading what Patti has to say because I love reading about life if the 60's.

Whatever Patti has to say about George (and Eric, too) won't change the way I feel about them. My opinion has been firmly formed about George for many years. :smile1:

I am so glad you say this, Lynn... If opinions changed because of Pattie's 'urge to purge' it would be tragic.

[beatlebangs1964]

I love the 60s and reading of life during the Dodge Dart Era...let's hope Pattie has proven herself to be a "paperback writer" and that her book isn't a bash 'em, trash 'em exercise.

Her book ain't gonna change my opinion of George or Eric - she ain't got that kind of control. Still, it will be interesting to read her take on things. It is a mitzvah, a good thing that Eric, George and Pattie were able to remain friends....George even said himself that he was glad Pattie was with Eric instead of "some dope..." George and Pattie had moved and grown in different directions and since the twain were no longer meeting, no longer a meeting of the minds, interests and expectations, it was, I think best that they did what they thought was right. It was a decision only they could make.

[Hari's Chick]

more thoughts... about Pattie' excepts~

"We met secretly at a flat in South Kensington. Eric Clapton had asked me to come because he wanted me to listen to a new number he had written.
He switched on the tape machine, turned up the volume and played me the most powerful, moving song I had ever heard. It was Layla, about a man who falls hopelessly in love with a woman who loves him but is unavailable.
He played it to me two or three times, all the while watching my face intently for my reaction. My first thought was: 'Oh God, everyone's going to know this is about me.' "

First what bothers me is how in one small paragraph she is cheating/emasculating George ... telling us that the whole while she is getting giddy with EC, George was not even crossing her mind. Then she says Layla was the *most powerful, moving* song she had ever heard. Thus, she tells the public that i her opinion George is comparitively inconsequetial musically to EC. She basically takes any love or sentiment George has gifted her with musically and drops it in the trash can. THEN she goes on to explain her first thoughts were what the public would think.

For George, he had fans surrounding him not seeing him as 'real'. Now again he is seen as wallpaper... by the one person who was supposed to take care with his heart most of all.

Sure, there is the argument that George 'was no saint himself'... yet at this period he was (if I have my dates right in my head) undergoing a HUGE amount personally/emotionally. His band was disbanding. He was finally 'allowed' to be expressive, creatively, with his first 'real' solo lp. His Mom had just died. He had just moved residences (and FP was in terrible disrepair according to Shymasundara). And through all this chaos... terrible chaos.... George remains 'more or less' true to Pattie. For example, while on tour with Delany and Bonnie ... according to I think it was Delany... he said George loved Pattie very much and ignored the thousands of groupies who'd wait for him at the bus. Delainy says George fell off the spiritual wagon at the time with *alcohol*.... not girls.

More Pattie~

"I was married to Eric's close friend, George Harrison, but Eric had been making his desire for me clear for months. I felt uncomfortable that he was pushing me in a direction in which I wasn't certain I wanted to go.
But with the realisation that I had inspired such passion and creativity, the song got the better of me. I could resist no longer. "

So, picking this apart... we see it was all ego? She was inspiring 'passion and creativity' so she could 'resist no longer'....??

Read~
"George just lost his Mom, his band, his life structure, his residence.. but hey, I am Pattie Boyd... and no one is looking at me ..."

Right when George needed someone to really love him.... where was she?

"He was about to leave when he spotted me in the garden with Eric. It was just getting light, and very misty. George came over and demanded: 'What's going on?' To my horror, Eric said: 'I have to tell you, man, that I'm in love with your wife.' I wanted to die. George was furious. He turned to me and said: 'Well, are you going with him or coming with me?' "

So it was not enough to just abandon him when he had so many hard things going on... no.. Pattie had to add to it by accepting advances from George's best friend.

"But, in fact, by then our relationship was in trouble. Since a trip to the Maharishi Mahesh Yogi's ashram in India in 1968, George had become obsessive about meditation. He was also sometimes withdrawn and depressed."

George was by 1968 seeing the limits of happiness in the material world. He had everything- looks, money, any girl he'd have wanted...but like Olivia said later, George was shell shocked by the events in the Beatles. Further, he was marginalized. Then he went to India and things began to make sense. I speculate his depression and withdrawl could have been what mystics call 'the dark night of the soul'. Dark Night of the soul is what Buddha experieced when He said, "I'm going to meditate and not even eat until I can know and understand WHY there is death, disease, and suffering in this world." Buddha said, "If I cannot know WHY I would rather be dead." I postulate after all George had seen that he was going through this, and prehaps it would even recur at times later and he would need to remind himself of what he'd come to Know.

"My moods started to mirror his and at times I felt almost suicidal. I don't think I was ever in any real danger of killing myself but I got as far as working out how I would do it: put on a diaphanous Ossie Clark dress and throw myself off Beachy Head."

He was depressed?? Within the time period Pattie refereces here, George's MOM died! But why mention that? That has nothing to do with Real issues, as discussing suicide fashion is far more important. :rolleyes:


Further, she says on some part that George had 'many Apple Scruffs'. Well, I really wonder... because in Apple Scruff Carol Bedford's book she wanted to be able to insinuate something between her and George and the most she could come up with was that he asked for a shoulder massage.. oh and that someone (was it Mal? i forget) asked to hook her up for George in an apt in LA.. well... maybe it happened and maybe not. Maybe it was George and maybe not. Lots of roadies and suport people have their own intentions.

And finally... if Pattie had an issue with an indescretion here or there ..why did she not mind George's adventures in the brothels of India.. ( from Derek's book).. she was sending mixed messages to George and then wants to blame him for it.

[beatlebangs1964]

more thoughts... about Pattie' excepts~

"
For George, he had fans surrounding him not seeing him as 'real'. Now again he is seen as wallpaper... by the one person who was supposed to take care with his heart most of all.

Sure, there is the argument that George 'was no saint himself'... yet at this period he was (if I have my dates right in my head) undergoing a HUGE amount personally/emotionally. His band was disbanding. He was finally 'allowed' to be expressive, creatively, with his first 'real' solo lp. His Mom had just died. He had just moved residences (and FP was in terrible disrepair according to Shymasundara). And through all this chaos... terrible chaos.... George remains 'more or less' true to Pattie. For example, while on tour with Delany and Bonnie ... according to I think it was Delany... he said George loved Pattie very much and ignored the thousands of groupies who'd wait for him at the bus. Delainy says George fell off the spiritual wagon at the time with *alcohol*.... not girls.

Well said. George underwent major metamorphoses during this point in his life. I know somebody who knew George and the senior Harrisons personally and said that George was never the same after Louise the Elder died in 1970. It was a crushing loss that George felt for the rest of his life.

Some of these excerpts sound like Devil's Radio to me.

The quote that Hari's Chick provided us above, "Read~
"George just lost his Mom, his band, his life structure, his residence.. but hey, I am Pattie Boyd... and no one is looking at me ..."

Right when George needed someone to really love him.... where was she?" makes me wonder about Pattie's motives. George did undergo some major losses and adjustments during this period in his life - the loss of a loved one; the end of the Beatles and Pattie is now saying that it ain't about her and it should be and people should be looking at her? What is that? :rolleyes:

"He was about to leave when he spotted me in the garden with Eric. It was just getting light, and very misty. George came over and demanded: 'What's going on?' To my horror, Eric said: 'I have to tell you, man, that I'm in love with your wife.' I wanted to die. George was furious. He turned to me and said: 'Well, are you going with him or coming with me?' "

So it was not enough to just abandon him when he had so many hard things going on... no.. Pattie had to add to it by accepting advances from George's best friend.

The timing was bad, I admit it...it takes two to tango and Eric doe have a part in this as well.

In fairness, I think Pattie and George had plainly grown apart and their interests, needs and expectations were vastly divergent...India was just the turning point. It was what brought things to a head, but I think it was coming sooner or later. I also think that, from all accounts I've been given, (written and oral) that their relationship was initially one of physical attraction. George was drawn to the blond, leggy, toothy model and in time realized that they were not a good marital match. It was, I think a realization that came to both sides as it does take two to tango and there are at least two sides to every story.

Hari's Chick, George was blessed with so much. God blessed him with extraordinary looks; a loving family; intelligence, talent and opportunities most people can't even begin to imagine enjoying. He was blessed with many who loved him, George the person and not George the performer/famous person. He was blessed with a son. He was blessed with a delightful, droll acerbic wit. He was also blessed with a wonderful sense of the ironic.


George was by 1968 seeing the limits of happiness in the material world. He had everything- looks, money, any girl he'd have wanted...but like Olivia said later, George was shell shocked by the events in the Beatles. Further, he was marginalized. Then he went to India and things began to make sense. I speculate his depression and withdrawl could have been what mystics call 'the dark night of the soul'. Dark Night of the soul is what Buddha experieced when He said, "I'm going to meditate and not even eat until I can know and understand WHY there is death, disease, and suffering in this world." Buddha said, "If I cannot know WHY I would rather be dead." I postulate after all George had seen that he was going through this, and prehaps it would even recur at times later and he would need to remind himself of what he'd come to Know.

George was, I think quite vulnerable during this period and the dissolution of his marriage, which sounded to me like it was in trouble had to be yet another apple to upset his cart. The death of Louise was a major loss and a traumatic event in George's life. Somebody I know who knew the Harrisons personally said that George grieved for her on some level for the rest of his life. And yeah, why would Pattie mention that? It ain't about her, that's why! Becoming a prospective Beachy Head casualty took the forefont of her mind, not the loss of her mother-in-law who, from all accounts was an extremely loving and generally nice person.

Carol Bedford's book about the Apple Scruffs is a good companion book to Pat Kinzer Mancuso's book, Do You Want to Know a Secret? The Story of the Official George Harrison Fan Club. I for one don't believe Carol Bedford and George had anything going on...sounds sorta like Francie Schwartz, who acted such a fool after her affair with Paul went out the window, literally. Ms. Schwartz continues to act a fool to this day and her book is, in my not so humble opinion tawdry trash that makes GG and Goldman's books look like rare art forms.

Hari's Chick made a good point about Ms. Bedford's hinting that she and George were together intimately. There is no way to prove or disprove that and frankly, it really doesn't matter...I think that based on the context in which Ms. Bedford's statements were written and her strong attraction to George, she wanted it to happen and to create the impression that even the most casual acknowledgement was something more than it was.

Pat Kinzer Mancuso said of Bedford's book that it contained inaccuracies. She said that Carol Beford wrote that she [Mancuso] was leading people on tours of where Louise Harrison's grave was and this understandably upet George and Harold, Sr. She is quite emphatic that at no time did she ever take anybody to the final resting place and that to this day she won't disclose it.

Good question, Hari's Chick. Why didn't Pattie raise objections (and we don't know that she did not) to George frequenting the brothels of India? If that was the case, that states all the more that their marriage was in trouble. If he was looking outside the marriage, he plainly was not finding the solace and support and whatever else he needed then in that marriage. It ain't a matter of blame; to be fair about it, I really think that marriage was a sinking ship from fairly early on. They met in 1964. George, then barely 21 was very attracted to her. They were married less than two years later. Then, one year after their marriage, it was made clear to Pattie that George was seeing other people. In many books and articles I have read, she was devastated by this. What I have trouble with is how she is laying all the blame for their marital problems on George when in fairness, I don't think it is a matter of blame; it is a matter of how they had different interests, needs, expectations and visions.

They were very young when they got married. It is possible that they both needed time and a chance to know more about themselves and who and what they really wanted. A lot of maturation takes place during those early adult years. Just my take on this.

[Hari's Chick]

Well said. George underwent major metamorphoses during this point in his life. I know somebody who knew George and the senior Harrisons personally and said that George was never the same after Louise the Elder died in 1970. It was a crushing loss that George felt for the rest of his life.

Louise, Sr seems like such a dear. It is so understandable George would feel such a tremendous loss with her passing over. I believe what you say here, BB. It is well imaginable.



Some of these excerpts sound like Devil's Radio to me.
The quote that Hari's Chick provided us above, "Read~
"George just lost his Mom, his band, his life structure, his residence.. but hey, I am Pattie Boyd... and no one is looking at me ..."

Right when George needed someone to really love him.... where was she?" makes me wonder about Pattie's motives. George did undergo some major losses and adjustments during this period in his life - the loss of a loved one; the end of the Beatles and Pattie is now saying that it ain't about her and it should be and people should be looking at her? What is that? :rolleyes:

That is how it read to me.. that is how I read it. None of the excepts mention Pattie speaking empatheically towards all George was going through at that time.


The timing was bad, I admit it...it takes two to tango and Eric doe have a part in this as well.

I never cared for EC as a person. I used to go to his shows and get up front (in case George would turn up). I would bring flowers... with a note asking to give them to George, please. :laugh5: :wink1:

In fairness, I think Pattie and George had plainly grown apart and their interests, needs and expectations were vastly divergent...India was just the turning point. It was what brought things to a head, but I think it was coming sooner or later. I also think that, from all accounts I've been given, (written and oral) that their relationship was initially one of physical attraction. George was drawn to the blond, leggy, toothy model and in time realized that they were not a good marital match. It was, I think a realization that came to both sides as it does take two to tango and there are at least two sides to every story.

I am not convinced this is the case, though yes, I have heard that said by George himself... "we were breaking up for years.." But that would also be a very pisces thing to say. ("unless you leave her first, then you come out on top... but there is just one thing you haven't got... peace of mind..." ~ Neil Young).

According to Delany ... on the tour George joined, while leaving Pattie at home... George did not cheat and the reason according to Delany was that George was "very in love with Pattie". According to Pattie, George got angry when he found she and EC in the garden. "He was furious" she says. Pattie says in the excepts that on her last night at FP George said, "Don't go..." Look at the liner notes for the Dark Horse album~ "backing vocals.. Pattie and Eric" ... look at his interpretation of "Bye Bye Love". George put Olivia's picture on the Dark Horse lp label on one side, his on the other. Even the Dark Horse song was, imho, all a piscean reaction to being mistreated (and publically) by Pattie.

I'm not convinced it was over and done. George was not apathetic.


George was, I think quite vulnerable during this period and the dissolution of his marriage, which sounded to me like it was in trouble had to be yet another apple to upset his cart. The death of Louise was a major loss and a traumatic event in George's life. Somebody I know who knew the Harrisons personally said that George grieved for her on some level for the rest of his life. And yeah, why would Pattie mention that? It ain't about her, that's why! Becoming a prospective Beachy Head casualty took the forefont of her mind, not the loss of her mother-in-law who, from all accounts was an extremely loving and generally nice person.

Yes..exactly... how sad? So sad for George and he was so brave, reading Louise, Sr the Gita at the hospital.



Carol Bedford's book about the Apple Scruffs is a good companion book to Pat Kinzer Mancuso's book, Do You Want to Know a Secret? The Story of the Official George Harrison Fan Club. I for one don't believe Carol Bedford and George had anything going on...sounds sorta like Francie Schwartz, who acted such a fool after her affair with Paul went out the window, literally. Ms. Schwartz continues to act a fool to this day and her book is, in my not so humble opinion tawdry trash that makes GG and Goldman's books look like rare art forms.


LOL!

Hari's Chick made a good point about Ms. Bedford's hinting that she and George were together intimately. There is no way to prove or disprove that and frankly, it really doesn't matter...I think that based on the context in which Ms. Bedford's statements were written and her strong attraction to George, she wanted it to happen and to create the impression that even the most casual acknowledgement was something more than it was.

I agree, yeah. Yet even in her book, she says George once asked her into his car. According to her, he drove her home and asked her why she waited for him. He said to her, "What is it you expect of me? I am married?" and made some reference about how he could not marry them all. It was said in a sort of context of care... not being stuck up.. more like "you should be doing something else, than waiting for me.." It seemed sweet and concerned.

Pat Kinzer Mancuso said of Bedford's book that it contained inaccuracies. She said that Carol Beford wrote that she [Mancuso] was leading people on tours of where Louise Harrison's grave was and this understandably upet George and Harold, Sr. She is quite emphatic that at no time did she ever take anybody to the final resting place and that to this day she won't disclose it.

Oh that is not good. I'm sorry Carol's book had hurtful inaccuracies about Mancuso.

Good question, Hari's Chick. Why didn't Pattie raise objections (and we don't know that she did not) to George frequenting the brothels of India? If that was the case, that states all the more that their marriage was in trouble. If he was looking outside the marriage, he plainly was not finding the solace and support and whatever else he needed then in that marriage.

Well, she sent Derek her love at the end of the same letter George had hand written about the brothels... and she sounded quite cheerful.

It was a different time period, too. It had been the concervative 50's and was now the Swinging 60's. There is a great scene from the movie/musical HAIR where one of the fellow's traditional g/f's shows up pregnant, trying to find him. She meets another girl, also pregnant, and who is excited that their babies might be siblings... that it would be cool and wild... and the traditional g/f is horified by this! lol Well, it was a different time period. Now maybe it could be on Jerry Springer with people who lacked formal education. But this was different time, hippie culture was breaking the stereotypes and molds with thought. There was analysis and forward intellectual excitement. It was a culturally dynamic time. So, George going to the brothels could have been taken in one stride, and now upon reflection Pattie may find it distasteful. And again, yeah, George is not here to say... and should not even have had to say. :(



It ain't a matter of blame; to be fair about it, I really think that marriage was a sinking ship from fairly early on. They met in 1964. George, then barely 21 was very attracted to her. They were married less than two years later. Then, one year after their marriage, it was made clear to Pattie that George was seeing other people. In many books and articles I have read, she was devastated by this. What I have trouble with is how she is laying all the blame for their marital problems on George when in fairness, I don't think it is a matter of blame; it is a matter of how they had different interests, needs, expectations and visions.

I'm not convinced that George was done with her. But on some level her shallow fashion concerns and lack of compassion may have made him frustrated and feel alone, yeah. I can well see and understand how he would feel that. How even now she says he was "obsessed with his Guru, (Prabhupada)" shows that even now she does not understand the beauty of the Guru/disciple relationship, nor it's value, nor it's depth.

They were very young when they got married. It is possible that they both needed time and a chance to know more about themselves and who and what they really wanted. A lot of maturation takes place during those early adult years. Just my take on this.


Good thoughts, all, BB!!

[beatlebangs1964]

I'm not convinced that George was done with her. But on some level her shallow fashion concerns and lack of compassion may have made him frustrated and feel alone, yeah. I can well see and understand how he would feel that. How even now she says he was "obsessed with his Guru, (Prabhupada)" shows that even now she does not understand the beauty of the Guru/disciple relationship, nor it's value, nor it's depth.

I think you're onto something here...I think George was largely physically attracted to her and wanted the marriage to work, but by then [1967 and beyond] had to acknowledge that they were not a suitable marital match. Theirs was plainly not a marriage made in heaven, as the saying goes.

I think it was only natural for George to want to share with Pattie things that were serious and important to him. From all accounts, the India '67 experience did not leave the indelible spiritual stamp on her and she and George lost a lot of footing on common ground. Bottom line is they were moving in different directions; two divergent rivers that were not flowing together or flowing into one another...(life flows on within you, without you...)

It is understandable that George would lament Pattie's placing superficial matters and her personal fashion above compassion and extending oneself to others. The tone of this book, judging from the excerpts is one of somebody who is stuck in that place in time. I don't know and maybe I am wrong, but what bothers me about what I've read so far is that Pattie's tone does sound like that young woman of decades ago who pursued what some might deem shallow and superficial interests instead of seeking the beauty of the Guru/disciple; God/human relationship nor other such serious matters. I don't get the sense of Pattie being into serious and heavy topics and issues; somehow I cannot picture her and George in a conversation. What did they talk to each other about? Part of having a good relationship is you have to love talking to the person and listening to what they tell you. Sharing common visions and interests is an important part of making it work.

[sadie]

Not sure if this has been posted, but this won't help matters.

How Eric Clapton's ex got her revenge - with a little help from George Harrison

By AMANDA PERTHEN - More by this author » (http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/dmsearch/overture.html?in_page_id=711&in_overture_ua=cat&in_start_number=0&in_restriction=byline&in_query=amanda perthen&in_name=on&in_order_by=relevance+date) Last updated at 23:51pm on 11th August 2007
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Pattie Boyd's autobiography revealed how she left George Harrison for Eric Clapton. Now Clapton's ex Lory Del Santo tells for the first time how she and Harrison got their own back...with a three-day affair of their own.


Model Lory Del Santo has told how she had an affair with George Harrison – so they could both get revenge on her womanising partner Eric Clapton. She says they secretly got together in Hiroshima, Japan, in December 1991, when Harrison and Clapton were playing on tour together, and spent three passionate days behind locked doors in Harrison's luxury suite at the Sun Plaza Hotel.

Lory describes it as an act of 'sweet revenge', because Clapton famously 'stole' Harrison's wife Pattie Boyd just four years after the Beatle married her in the Sixties.
The Italian-born model turned TV presenter says she also wanted revenge because Clapton had effectively 'frozen her out' after the tragic death of their four-year-old son Conor.
Pattie's amazing story of how Clapton seduced her was revealed last week in her autobiography, which is being serialised in The Mail on Sunday.
The rock legend was so obsessed with her that he openly told Harrison "I have to tell you, man, I'm in love with your wife", then went on to steal her, having written the classic song Layla in her honour. Now, in an astonishing twist, Lory has described how Harrison got his revenge – by inviting her to his suite behind Clapton's back. It was a bittersweet time for both of them – both had suffered at the hands of Clapton

Harrison had lost Pattie, while Lory was having to deal with her son's death alone, because Clapton refused to talk about it.
In an interview with acclaimed journalist Daphne Barak, to be screened on American TV later this month, Lory says: "It was amazing...we had so much to talk about. I will never forget that time. The memory of those three days are still with me."
Harrison was still smarting from Clapton's shameless pursuit of his wife, and took the opportunity to question Lory about the rock star's womanising ways.
As the couple relaxed in Harrison's suite, they discussed the devastating effect Clapton had on both their lives.
Lory, 46, says: "It was so private ...so special. He asked a lot of questions about Eric. He needed to. And I needed to talk...He was so sweet. He was very caring. It was not all about sex." Later Harrison arranged for the hotel's Olympic-sized swimming pool to be closed off so the pair could have it to themselves. "In the pool, he was so sweet. He kept massaging my feet," says Lory.

The tryst happened three months after little Conor fell to his death from the window of the couple's 53rd-floor apartment in New York, when Lory's back was turned for just a few seconds. The tragedy ripped the couple apart and they separated shortly afterwards.
Lory says: "With Eric, I couldn't talk. He was always very distant, even worse after Conor's [death]. I was not sleeping with Eric at that time."
Asked by Ms Barak – whose recent interviews have included Hillary Clinton, Adnan Khashoggi and Robert Mugabe – if the love tryst was 'payback' for Clapton stealing Harrison's wife, Lory says: "It could have started as a payback day.
"He probably had revenge in his mind, but so did I. We were both hurt, angry with Eric. But what might have started as revenge became so special.
"I realised, 'Wow! George Harrison really likes me... And I like him a lot! He was a very quiet person. He cared whether I ate, he let me talk. He cared about what I had to say. Time just flew by.
"It probably started because we both wanted revenge. We were hurting. We had this loneliness. But it turned out to be something special."
Clapton never found out about the liaison. "It is not that George and I were hiding," says Lory. "But we spent a lot of time in his suite upstairs. We wanted to have a private time. So both George and I got even [with Eric]. I didn't want to tell Eric or talk about it. I didn't want to ruin the moment."
The couple parted with Harrison bidding a romantic farewell. Lory reveals: "He did everything to perfection. No gifts. He called me and he said, 'I hope to see you.'
"But I knew we would never see each other. I am sure he knew... He told me, 'You are so sweet. I can't believe a man would never want to be with you for ever.'"
Asked by Ms Barak if she regretted it, Lory replies: "Sometimes, but there in Hiroshima, that was a perfect moment for us."
Lory was born into a strict Roman Catholic family. Her father died young and her mother worked long hours to make ends meet.
But Lory had ambitions and pursued a dual career of modelling and TV presenting. She is still a presenter on Italian TV, runs a gym and lets apartments in Milan. One of her former boyfriends is Adnan Khashoggi and she has a 13-year-old son Devin, by Milan businessman Silvio Sardi, from whom she is now separate

[Georgie Girl]

Hmm, not sure if I believe any of that. Sounds like a lot of wishful thinking by a heartbroken mother who has had a bit of instability in her life.

[sadie]

I know, it doesn't ring true to me either, not because I don't want to believe it or anything, he wasn't an angel, he had affairs, but it just doesn't sit with me. If it is true, I believe he got carried away with the moment (after all they do say if its laid on a plate, especially by a beautiful woman, no man can say no) but no way would he do it as revenge on Eric, not his style.

[Georgie Girl]

Yeah, I don't believe that George was still hurting over the Pattie-and-Eric thing after being with Olivia all those years. Besides, what would they have done to Eric? Nothing. Yet George would risk his marriage? I think he was, by 1991, more mature than that, more grounded.

[Hari's Chick]

he wasn't an angel


Sure he was... and his horns held up his halo. :wink2:

[sadie]

LOLOLOL that is true! Not sure he would have been so sexy were he perfect, that devilish side of him was just mmmmmmm.:blush4:

[Hari's Chick]

Yes, that mmmmm factor! :teeth1:

[I am the Paulrus]

Pattie Boyd: Life after George Harrison and Eric Clapton

18th August 2007

By LIZ JONES, The Daily Mail

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/live/live.html?in_article_id=476091&in_page_id=1889

'I clung on to my marriages thinking they would get better'

Pattie Boyd was the much-envied swinging 60s model who married George Harrison and Eric Clapton.

But living the rock wife highlife was fraught with heartbreak and insecurity, as her new autobiography reveals. Here she tells Liz Jones why she's so much happier today.

There are so many wonderful stories in Pattie Boyd's life. Going to the cinema with Elvis.

Hanging out with Sinatra.

Watching Princess Margaret being handed a joint.

Being model scouted while working on an Elizabeth Arden beauty counter and then photographed by David Bailey.

Falling in love with a Beatle. Falling in love with another famous rock star, Eric Clapton, and being serenaded with 'Wonderful Tonight', the song he wrote while watching her get ready for a party.

Pattie's ever-present diary was full of entries like, 'Took George home to meet family in E-type Jag…' 'Went to Ireland with John and Cynthia.'

But there is much that is excruciating in her life story – which she has expanded from the diaries into a book, Wonderful Today – that you wonder whether the painful outweighed the magical.

That she might have been happier had she not met George Harrison on the set of A Hard Day's Night; had she not got caught up in all the drugs and the mansions and men who behaved like little boys.

When I say this she does her big laugh. 'They were like little boys!' she shouts. 'They should have been wearing short grey trousers!'

We are due to meet in a hotel in Notting Hill, and when a tiny woman with a nest of blond hair, big breasts and skinny legs in jeans and high-heeled boots brushes past me on the stairs, I know instantly it's Pattie.

She still has that startling face made famous in a Smith's Crisps TV ad: the very blue, round, innocent eyes, the slightly prominent teeth.

When I tell her she looks exactly the same she laughs, and puts it down to the fact she has never had plastic surgery.

She had come up to London the night before from her cottage in Sussex to stay with a girlfriend; she is worried the rabbits will be eating her sunflowers and can't wait to get home.

She has lots of female friends now, she says, and no man in her life.

A better state of affairs than having a cheating man to worry about, and no female friends because she's afraid they'll steal him?

'I learned to distinguish predatory women from ordinary ones. I did occasionally get the predatory ones out of the way but I had to be on the lookout all the time. It was exhausting!'

I ask why she has chosen to publish her autobiography now, at the age of 63.

'I've always thought I was a very private person, and then my sister-in-law said, 'Pattie, have you Googled your name?' 'I was amazed that there was all this information about me; obviously not all of it correct.

'But I'd always felt that until I'd made a success of something of my own, I shouldn't do a book.

'Now that I've had two photographic exhibitions [including portraits of famous friends and landscapes from her travels] in San Francisco that were very well received, I feel the timing is right.

'People say it's cathartic to write a book, but it turned out to be quite painful!'


Although her first husband, George Harrison, died of cancer in 2001, her second, Eric Clapton, formerly of the Yardbirds and Cream, is still very much alive, and

I wonder what he thinks of his portrayal in her book, which is far from flattering.

'I'm not worried about him reading it – should I be?' she asks, looking worried.

'I asked if I could publish his letters and he said yes.

'But what's odd is that he didn't want to know which letters I wanted to use…but he writes beautifully, he's obviously confident about what he's written.'

Goodness. The letters.

Never was a woman so relentlessly pursued and then so cruelly cast aside...

Pattie Boyd was born on 17 March 1944, and spent her early childhood in West Lothian.

Pattie's mother, Diana, was born in India; her father, Jock, was badly burned in the RAF, which prematurely ended his career, and the family moved to Kenya when Pattie was four to join her maternal grandparents.

She loved Kenya, but always felt very distant from her mother. When she was sent to boarding school in Nakuru aged eight, she knew 'something bad was happening at home'.

It turned out her mother was having an affair, and she soon returned to England, leaving Pattie, two of her siblings and her father in Africa.

Pattie describes her father as 'always behind a newspaper. He was awkward, distant' (and unfaithful) – precisely the type of man she was to end up marrying, twice.

A year later, in 1953, her mother sent for her children; Pattie wouldn't see her father again for three decades.

Again, she was packed off to boarding school. She says that as a child she felt 'rejected and abandoned'.

Her deepest fear is of being abandoned again.

She likes to cling on, though: 'I am a very positive person, and I clung on in my marriages thinking, “I'm sure it will get better!"

Her parents are still alive.

What does her mother think of the book?

'She was sad that I'd had an unhappy childhood, but I told her, 'Mummy, I'm hardly suffering now. Look at me – I'm fine.'

I'm blessed with the fact that I'm a fighter. I've always known life was meant to be joyful.'

Despite gracing the cover of Vogue numerous times, and having three of arguably the greatest love songs ever written for her (before 'Wonderful Tonight', Clapton had penned 'Layla', a paen to his unrequited love for her, and she inspired George to write the Beatles' 'Something'), Pattie has never felt remotely lovable.

'I was terribly self-critical,' she says.

'I think modelling is a very difficult thing. It's glamorous and fun, but underneath it all, you know your flaws and those are what you focus on.'

[I am the Paulrus]

Like so many women, she blames herself for both of her husbands' infidelities.

Perhaps because her father and stepfather had affairs she didn't expect anything better?

Repeatedly, in her book and during our conversation, she berates herself for not being more patient.

I suggest that the men she married were so infantile they shoved her into a sort of mummy role.

'I don't know whether the mummy role was inherent because I was the eldest of six or because I never had children,' she says.

Although both George and Eric were hugely talented, I wonder whether either was worth the bother.

George spent most of his time smoking marijuana, meditating or playing his guitar.

Eric cheated on Pattie almost before the ink dried on their wedding certificate.

The sex can't have been that great, either, I say: Eric was a drug addict, then an alcoholic.

But she will only say tactfully, 'It could be so annoying!'

Pattie and George were married on 21 January 1966. She was 21, he was 22. She wore a Mary Quant dress and fur coat.

Her father didn't come to the wedding. They moved into a modest 60s house in Esher, Surrey, and spent their time smoking joints rolled by Bob Dylan and sitting on furniture from a trendy new store called Habitat.

Everything was fine.

It was when they moved to Friar Park, a mansion near Henley-on-Thames, that the problems started.

The house, soon stuffed with antiques, became a constant reminder to George of how far he had strayed from his roots; he felt he didn't deserve it.

And the house was so big Pattie could never keep tabs on him. She says that George 'hated the touring, the fame; he was frightened of the fans, he never got any peace; he became withdrawn, depressed'.

She says he always felt excluded artistically from the Beatles, and his moods weren't helped when their manager Brian Epstein died; she says he felt like an orphan.

It was through Pattie, who loved to travel, that, in 1968, George met the Maharishi, furthering an interest in the East that had begun a couple of years earlier when George met sitar master Ravi Shankar.

George became a vegetarian, and meditated for hours every day. I venture that he was a hypocrite: he'd seek enlightenment, but he also took cocaine. 'Drugs hardened his heart,' she admits.

Pattie would arrive home to find him with other women; they seemed to teem around the house like woodlice.

'Because of my fragile ego, I saw it as betrayal,' she says.

'I would look at all these girls and think, “Oh my God, they're all so beautiful.'''

I tell her, but it was betrayal!

Why did you put up with it?

And she just shrugs. Like most insecure men, George was jealous of her fame, and to appease him she pretty much gave up modelling.

'Without a job and without actually doing anything except look after somebody, it lessens your value.

'George didn't want me to be famous; he just wanted me to be quiet at home. And so that's when I started taking pictures.

I wanted to do something.'

While she and George were growing further apart, Eric Clapton was sending 'the most passionate letters anyone had ever written to me'.

Wanting to save her marriage, she rejected him, and in turn he threatened to take the heroin he had in his hand.

'He said, “That's it, I'm off.”'

She hardly saw him for three years. And he was true to his word: he became addicted to heroin, almost taking his then girlfriend, Paula, Pattie's younger sister ('he wanted the closest thing to me') down with him.

Did she blame herself?

'No, it was his choice. It was appalling!'

Neither does she blame herself for the path chosen by Paula, whom she has helped many times over the years and who is waiting to go into rehab.

'I wasn't deliberately taking her into a rock'n'roll world. She knew all the Beatles, they [her siblings] all did.'

But as George continued the chanting and the affairs, Pattie finally gave in to Eric, and in 1973 left George to join him on tour.

Does she think things might have been different if she had had a child with George?

'Well, there would have been a point of reference for both of you that would be lifelong,' she says sadly.

Her new life with Eric, in yet another mansion, took on an eerily familiar pattern.

She subjugated her life to his: to keep up with him she took marijuana, uppers, downers, cocaine, even heroin, and became an alcoholic as she tried to keep up with his drinking.

Her family had loved George but they hated Eric, who had no social graces: 'He'd get up in the middle of dinner and just walk off,' she recalls. He could also be cruel.

Once, she found him at home with someone called Jenny, and he said, 'I'm in love with this girl. Just f*** off.'

On another occasion, she took delivery of a brand new Ferrari and as a surprise went to pick him up at the airport.

He was so disgusted she had driven it before him that he immediately sold it. He was awful, I tell Pattie, and she laughs.

But she is still so forgiving when she says, 'For a musician to come home and be as wonderful a person as they are on stage is impossible.

'It's ludicrous to expect them to be as fabulous a human being in day-to-day life.' Both men were extravagant (George once littered his drive with rubies instead of gravel), but Pattie was so ashamed at not being able to have children that, upon divorcing them, she walked away with almost nothing.

From George, she took £120,000 and a Mercedes.

She wrote to Eric, asking him to buy her a house in the country; he refused.

Only much later did he sign over a cottage in her name. I ask whether she would have found a nice, normal man who adored her far too boring.

'I would! I realise I like difficult men! I like something to battle with.

If somebody is too easy and adores me, I might crush them, which would be cruel.'

In 1985, soon after Eric Clapton had played at the first Live Aid concert, he met Lori del Santo, an actress.

He told Pattie he had fallen in love. Is that what made it different? She put up with his groupies?

'Yes.' But not when he said he was in love with someone else?

'No, that's different. I think boys play, they are silly boys, but if they fall…if there's an emotional attachment – that's very different.'

Yet she still clung on to their marriage, even after Lori gave birth to a son, Conor, the following year.

Eric would come home to Pattie after visiting him, bursting with fatherly pride. At the time, Pattie was going through IVF. 'In a funny way, he expected me to be pleased,' she says. Does she regret not having children? 'Yes, but the thing is, I tried, so it can't be a regret, can it?'

They divorced in 1989. Two years later, Conor died when he fell from a 53rd-floor window in Manhattan.

To make matters worse, the papers dug up the story that Eric had already fathered another child, a daughter, and had been paying maintenance for the past six years.

But Pattie was there for him.

'I wrote to Eric when Conor died, and he rang me. He was very fragile. I went to the funeral with him. He asked me to.' I really admire Pattie Boyd.

She was taught by her parents that she didn't deserve to be loved; she was told by her husbands that she wasn't worth very much, but here she is: not dead, not on drugs, not an alcoholic, but a survivor.

George was the love of her life. 'We grew up spiritually together – we learned everything together – and if you do that, there's a much tighter bond.

Hopefully, you'll be friends until you die. I remember the day we met.

I thought he was so beautiful and funny,' she says. 'I do regret [not being more forgiving]; that plagued me for years.

[FPSHOT]

I'm gonna try to merge this in to the running Pattie thread so please hold any replies for a little bit.

[FPSHOT]

ok, fixed it :)

[PepperlandFrog]

more thoughts... about Pattie' excepts~

"We met secretly at a flat in South Kensington. Eric Clapton had asked me to come because he wanted me to listen to a new number he had written.
He switched on the tape machine, turned up the volume and played me the most powerful, moving song I had ever heard. It was Layla, about a man who falls hopelessly in love with a woman who loves him but is unavailable.
He played it to me two or three times, all the while watching my face intently for my reaction. My first thought was: 'Oh God, everyone's going to know this is about me.' "

First what bothers me is how in one small paragraph she is cheating/emasculating George ... telling us that the whole while she is getting giddy with EC, George was not even crossing her mind. Then she says Layla was the *most powerful, moving* song she had ever heard. Thus, she tells the public that i her opinion George is comparitively inconsequetial musically to EC. She basically takes any love or sentiment George has gifted her with musically and drops it in the trash can. THEN she goes on to explain her first thoughts were what the public would think.

For George, he had fans surrounding him not seeing him as 'real'. Now again he is seen as wallpaper... by the one person who was supposed to take care with his heart most of all.

Sure, there is the argument that George 'was no saint himself'... yet at this period he was (if I have my dates right in my head) undergoing a HUGE amount personally/emotionally. His band was disbanding. He was finally 'allowed' to be expressive, creatively, with his first 'real' solo lp. His Mom had just died. He had just moved residences (and FP was in terrible disrepair according to Shymasundara). And through all this chaos... terrible chaos.... George remains 'more or less' true to Pattie. For example, while on tour with Delany and Bonnie ... according to I think it was Delany... he said George loved Pattie very much and ignored the thousands of groupies who'd wait for him at the bus. Delainy says George fell off the spiritual wagon at the time with *alcohol*.... not girls.

More Pattie~

"I was married to Eric's close friend, George Harrison, but Eric had been making his desire for me clear for months. I felt uncomfortable that he was pushing me in a direction in which I wasn't certain I wanted to go.
But with the realisation that I had inspired such passion and creativity, the song got the better of me. I could resist no longer. "

So, picking this apart... we see it was all ego? She was inspiring 'passion and creativity' so she could 'resist no longer'....??

Read~
"George just lost his Mom, his band, his life structure, his residence.. but hey, I am Pattie Boyd... and no one is looking at me ..."

Right when George needed someone to really love him.... where was she?

"He was about to leave when he spotted me in the garden with Eric. It was just getting light, and very misty. George came over and demanded: 'What's going on?' To my horror, Eric said: 'I have to tell you, man, that I'm in love with your wife.' I wanted to die. George was furious. He turned to me and said: 'Well, are you going with him or coming with me?' "

So it was not enough to just abandon him when he had so many hard things going on... no.. Pattie had to add to it by accepting advances from George's best friend. All i can really add here is that Pattie seems to be rather aloof in her describing her former mate George as Eric's friend. That seems pretty hurtful, but again i wonder what was their relationship really like. Seems like we will never know.

[PaulisMine]

I'm not sure if this is the right place for this or not, but I'll have a bash. The book is out today, I believe, and I am interested to hear what folks have to say about it once they read it. In the meantime, photos from the book are already turning up. So, I believe I may have found the hottest photo ever of George. You be the judge:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v13/PaulisMine/d079.jpg

[Asha]

I'm not sure if this is the right place for this or not, but I'll have a bash. The book is out today, I believe, and I am interested to hear what folks have to say about it once they read it. In the meantime, photos from the book are already turning up. So, I believe I may have found the hottest photo ever of George. You be the judge:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v13/PaulisMine/d079.jpg

That's the hottest pic of George... period! :drool:

[beatlebangs1964]

Honey George was very attractive -- the man was just too damn fine!

As for that book, I will read it as I've ordered it from Amazon. Once I finish it, I will review it.