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View Full Version : Previously Undiscovered "Introducing the Beatles" fake - Your Help Needed....


Harbidge
Nov 24, 2001, 04:37 PM
I have just received what I believe to be a recently undiscovered fake of the Introducing the Beatles US LP. We all know that this is the most heavily faked LP of all time, but every fake that has ever turned up has had the following 2 characteristics:

<LI> The phrase "THE BEATLES" was underneath the spindle hole.
<LI>The label lists the songs Love Me Do and P.S. I Love You.

The fake copy I recently bought though is different. the phrase 'THE BEATLES' is above the spindle hole, a charcteristic that previously only authentic copies had. The label also lists the songs Ask Me Why and Please, Please Me, which indicates a version 2 pressing. Version 2 pressings have never thought to have been faked before now. (Even though the actual record plays the version 1 songs).

This is where I need all your help. Could any of you who have copies of Introducing the Beatles, to go and look at their copies, and see if they have this version of fake. A picture of the labels can be found at the following page -
http://members.fortunecity.co.uk/paulisdead/intro/fake.html

The scan is at the very bottom, variation 3 of fake discs.

Thank you http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif

------------------
Paul is Dead - The Conclusive Evidence (http://www.paulisdead.latest-info.com)
The Definitive Introducing the Beatles Authentification Guide (http://introducing.cjb.net)

[This Message Has Been Edited By Harbidge On November 24, 2001 05:38 PM]

bearkat77
Nov 24, 2001, 09:43 PM
Well, Harb, I've studied my two copies of this album and have come to this conclusion:

I own one real and one fake copy. I'm not sure if I should be happy or sad at this moment. The fake one has the word "Stereophonic" across the top, but I can see George's shadow in the background. The record itself is definitely fake.

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http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/cat.gif
Bearkat77's Beatlemaniac Page (http://bearkat77.www9.50megs.com)
Bearkat77's Tribute to John Lennon (http://bearkatjl.50megs.com)
Bearkat77's Tribute to Ringo Starr (http://bearkatrs.50megs.com)

FPSHOT
Nov 27, 2001, 01:10 AM
I have two LP's of this one it mentions a number 1062 right above.

I will check the details later today and report.

------------------
There'll come a time when all of us must
leave here
Then nothing 'Sister Mary' can do
Will keep me here with you
As nothing in this life that I've been trying
Can equal of surpass the Art of Dying - George 1969

Harbidge
Nov 27, 2001, 01:34 AM
Well, I wouldn't check since there's an almost impossibility of you having a copy. I've emailed Bruce Spitzer (Of 'The Beatles on Vee Jay Records' book fame) and this is what he emailed me back with:

Thanks for your info on the fake. It is one I have not seen before. Could you please send me high quality scans of each label scanned full size at 350 dpi and send the files (jpeg OK) on a disc or CD to me at (deleted for Bruce's privacy). I may run the images in a later book in my Beatles American Records series.

Thanks again

Bruce


Am I excited about this? Is the Pope Catholic?

------------------
Paul is Dead - The Conclusive Evidence (http://www.paulisdead.latest-info.com)
The Definitive Introducing the Beatles Authentification Guide (http://introducing.cjb.net)

FPSHOT
Nov 27, 2001, 03:12 AM
Now I'm lost here.

Do you mean that by having those two maybe original LP's it is not worth checking?

If I would have a fake, is that good or bad.
If it is an original, is that good or bad.

http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/thinker.gif

------------------
There'll come a time when all of us must
leave here
Then nothing 'Sister Mary' can do
Will keep me here with you
As nothing in this life that I've been trying
Can equal of surpass the Art of Dying - George 1969

Harbidge
Nov 27, 2001, 04:26 AM
Let me start again.

I recently bought a fake copy of Introducing the Beatles from eBay, and since I had never seen anything like it before, I was wondering whether anyone here had the same kind of fake.

I emailed Bruce Spitzer about it, who said that he had never seen it before and has asked for scans of the labels. This is why I believe that nobody else has this version.

------------------
Paul is Dead - The Conclusive Evidence (http://www.paulisdead.latest-info.com)
The Definitive Introducing the Beatles Authentification Guide (http://introducing.cjb.net)

Harbidge
Nov 27, 2001, 04:32 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Tahoma, Arial, Sans-Serif">Quote:</font><HR>
If I would have a fake, is that good or bad.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It depends really. Fakes are extremely common and so are not worth much more than a few bucks. If it's sealed or in mint condition it might be worth more, like up to $20, but nothing really major.


<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Tahoma, Arial, Sans-Serif">Quote:</font><HR>
If it is an original, is that good or bad.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Good, of course! Because it's been co heavily counterfeited, originals have become quite rare. The cheapest most common version is apparently worth $100. Of course the original authentic version 1 copies are extremely rare (50 times rarer than version 2 copies) and so they're worth much more. It's hardly surprising that the most common fake is based on the most rare version. The version 1 brackets logo label is something that only comes along once in a blue moon and is 50 times rarer than the oval logo version 1 copies (simple maths makes the brackets logo V1 100 times rarer than version 2 copies, so if 100,000 V2's exist, then there's only 1,000 copies of the V1 brackets logo copy.

I'm confusing aren't I!


------------------
Paul is Dead - The Conclusive Evidence (http://www.paulisdead.latest-info.com)
The Definitive Introducing the Beatles Authentification Guide (http://introducing.cjb.net)

Harbidge
Nov 27, 2001, 04:36 AM
A couple of links to help everyone here with intro questions:
http://introducing.cjb.net
My excellent http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif site showing what to look for to authenticate your copy of introducing the Beatles.
http://www.eskimo.com/~bpentium/beatles/intro/intro.html
A price guide for every official version released. Also has some historical info and shows some authentification pointers.
http://www.friktech.com/btls/bc2.htm#INTRO
Another good site about Introducing the Beatles. Gives historical info and approximately how many copies of each version were pressed!!!

Apparently only 5,000 copies were pressed of the version 1 brackets logo, worth $1,500.

Would i get lynched in the street if I said I had a copy?

------------------
Paul is Dead - The Conclusive Evidence (http://www.paulisdead.latest-info.com)
The Definitive Introducing the Beatles Authentification Guide (http://introducing.cjb.net)

FPSHOT
Nov 27, 2001, 09:16 AM
OK, clear again Harb.

I will have a look at the links (again) and find out which versions I have.



------------------
There'll come a time when all of us must
leave here
Then nothing 'Sister Mary' can do
Will keep me here with you
As nothing in this life that I've been trying
Can equal of surpass the Art of Dying - George 1969

C-Moon
Nov 27, 2001, 02:21 PM
Wow, I didn't realize there was such an industry in counterfeit records!

Turns out I have a fake. It's interesting in its own right, but disappointing.

Were the other albums faked as well? I may need to check my entire collection ...

------------------
"Say the word & you'll be free. Say the word & be like me. Say the word I'm thinking of. Have you heard the word is Love? It's so fine, it's sunshine. It's the word LOVE."

Tim
Nov 27, 2001, 03:12 PM
The following LPs have been faked

Introducing the Beatles
The Beatles with Frank Ifield n Stage(Portait cover)
Songs,Pictures and Stories of the Fabulous Beatles
Hear The Beatles tell All
Butcher Cover
Magial Mystery tour mono(no gatefold cover or book)
Abbey Road(very poor)
Let It Be red apple
Christmas Album

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Tim
http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/churchill.gif
Tim Brent's Yellow Submarine Page (http://www.geocities.com/timbrent.geo)
The Beatles' Record Advertisements (http://members.tripod.co.uk/seltaeb)
The Beatles' Record Covers Yahoo! Club (http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/beatlesrecordcovers)
The Decca Auditions (http://timbrent.tripod.jp)

biglou114
Nov 27, 2001, 04:05 PM
I have a red apple 'Let It Be" , but I got it with the relaese of the real one what does it mean.

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Rachel1
Jan 17, 2008, 05:44 AM
Hello there,

I am a researcher on BBC 1's The One Show based in Manchester we are making a programme about Beatles memorabilia.
We are running our own mini antiques roadshow, looking specifically at Beatles memorabilia. The event will be held in Liverpool at Hard Days Night Hotel - Matthew St on Saturday 26th January. (FROM 11AM)

I would love to speak to anyone who's bought counterfeit Beatles memorabilia.

Email me at Rachel.davies@bbc.co.uk
Or call me on 0161 244 3076

Look forward to hearing from you.
Rachel

El Gos Coix
Jan 17, 2008, 11:59 PM
My excellent http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif site showing what to look for to authenticate your copy of introducing the Beatles.

Is it yours!!?? It's the only one of those sites that I already knew, and I've always held it in great esteem since I first saw it. In fact, at one moment I considered the idea of trying to get one of these LPs, and used the information therein to try not to be cheated... But in the end I decided it was too risky to buy one of these records through internet, without seeing it (I've never really seen one, either real or fake, in record fairs or shops).

jagatinho
Feb 05, 2008, 06:42 PM
Were singles also faked?

Yellow Matter Custard
Aug 23, 2009, 01:58 AM
I have a copy of this record that I think may be special.
I checked all the excellent links in this thread and can't find it listed on any of them.

Here are some details:

Front cover top does not have the word "STEREOPHONIC" printed on it.

Below the oval VEE JAY logo on the front cover it says "STEREO".

Bottom right hand corner on the front reads "LP 1062".

The back cover has all the song titles printed on it.

This version includes "Ask Me Why" and "Please, Please Me".
The coma is present in "Please, Please Me".
It does not appear to be a paste over.

Upper right hand corner on back cover reads "LP 1062".

The record label itself is a "bracket" version.

At 9:00 it reads "VJLP 1062".
Below that it reads "63-3402" on side one and "63-3403" on side two.
And below that is reads "LONG PLAYING".

At 12:00 below the bracketed VEE JAY logo it reads "INTRODUCING the BEATLES".
Right below that it reads "THE BEATLES".

At 3:00 it reads "SIDE 1" on side one and "SIDE 2" on side two.
Right below that it reads "MICROGROOVE".

AT 6:00 on both sides the tracks are listed.
Both sides have the "left justified titles".
Side two is justified so far left that the number "6" is almost into the "color bar".


Anyone have any thoughts on what version I have?
Is it real or fake?

Yellow Matter Custard
Aug 23, 2009, 10:07 PM
I was looking around for some more info on this and found my answers.

http://www.beatlescollecting.com/the-beatles/faqs/how-to-spot-fake-beatles-discs.html

Mine is the first example at that link.

It's fake but I've loved it for the past thirty-something years and will continue to do so.

El Gos Coix
Aug 21, 2011, 06:07 PM
Hi,

Today, I've bought a copy of "Introducing the Beatles". The good part is that I knew it was a fake, because it only cost $13.99, and I don't think a felt-tip pen smudge on the back cover should bring an original's price this low). But it seemed a really good fake, with good quality images both on the cover and on the labels, and that's why I bought it. I suppose that the knowledge on this record's fake versions has advanced much since this thread was last active. But I was (am) so excited about it -it's the first time I see a copy, fake or real, of this LP- that I've spent a couple of hours browsing the Internet trying to find a description of this exact version, to no avail. I'm on a trip, and won't be back home until mid-September, and since I cannot wait to check my copies of Cox's and Spizer's books, which are likely to explain everything there is to know about it, I've thought I'd just post this here, to see whether any of your experts (or someone with the books at hand) can identify this fake right away and tell me whether it's a usual one or not.

I'm following now what's said in Harbidge's site. As to the cover, its quality seems to be very good (not having an original to compare it with). It hasn't got the obnoxious brown border, and it's a mono cover. George's shadow is there in all its glory. The back has got the two columns, but it's the second version (with "Ask Me Why" and "Please, Please Me", with a comma). Both the front and the back are glossy (but moderately so, they're not mirrors!) It's got the bracket logo on the back. The inner flaps seem to be of the right size (I haven't got any way to measure them now, but I don't think they're half a centimeter long). Even if nothing till now screams "fake!" (which I'm not too sure about), the back cover is a slick glued on the cardboard, but the front cover is directly printed on it. Besides, the blue, red and yellow dots (well, I can only see clearly the blue and yellow ones) are there, forming a dim C on the cardboard above the slick, more or less above the second E in "Beatles".

The disc itself is mono, too. At least, it doesn't mention the word "Stereo". I haven't got a record player here, so I cannot chek anything about its really being mono, or about its sound quality, or about its really playing "Ask Me Why" and "Please, Please Me", and not "P.S. I Love You" and "Love Me Do". Labels are completely black (without the rainbow band), and ink is silver and not blurry (again, I cannot compare with an original, but the impression is very good). Both the title and the artists are written above the centre hole. I think, at a guess, that the space between the label and the last track is a bit below one inch (between 2 and 2.5 cm, I should say). The paper of the labels is flat and non-glossy. The vinyl itself seems good and not flimsy. The trail-off area has got first a triangle and 6307 written by hand and then, at some distance, a circle with an indistinct doodle inside, and 63-3402 behind, also by hand. Side two is the same, except for and X after the 6307. The logo on the labels is the simplest one (neither the oval or the brackets logo).

The inner sleeve is blank, with a plastified hole in the centre.

With all this load of data, can you tell me whether this is a very common fake or not? No matter what the answer is, I'm very happy with it. It looks great, and I haven't been cheated. What else can I ask for (except for getting enough money to buy the real thing, and a real butcher cover, and to hire Macca for my birthday party...)?




P. S. Out of topic, hello to everyone after a long absence. I changed jobs, and my spare time there isn't what it used to be (it was justified in my previous job, with long hiatuses between productive moments). Right now, I'm on a business trip to Berkeley, California (my first time in the States). It's been a long time since I bought a memento from one trip that's not a book or a Beatles vinyl record. So far, apart from the mentioned "Introducing the Beatles", I've got the U.S. versions of "A Hard Day's Night", "Rubber Soul" and "20 Greatest Hits", and "The Beatles Downunder"... I'll have to check what versions they are, and all that. Apart from that, I've been to Las Vegas watching "Love" (wow!), and I've brought some merchandising from there, too. And on my way here I had to change flights in London, and spend one night there at Heathrow, and meanwhile I went to take some pictures at Chiswick House, Brian's home in Chapel St. and the Beatles' flat in Green St. Quite a productive trip so far!

El Gos Coix
Sep 24, 2011, 08:42 AM
Hi,
Even if nothing till now screams "fake!" (which I'm not too sure about), the back cover is a slick glued on the cardboard, but the front cover is directly printed on it. Besides, the blue, red and yellow dots (well, I can only see clearly the blue and yellow ones) are there, forming a dim C on the cardboard above the slick, more or less above the second E in "Beatles".

I must correct something I said: I'm not sure any more that the front cover is printed on the cardboard. It seems to be a paper glued onto it.

Cannot anyone tell me whether this is a fake or not? I've been reading things here and there, looking it up in the books, and the only thing I can find that points in the direction of the fake is that dotted C I talked about. And even then, I'm not sure whether that is what was meant when this particular fake was described. And I cannot find a single feature of the disc typical of fakes. My record is mono and second version, but then, that C...