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domuso

Mar 21, 2001, 06:30 AM

Paul once said that 'I'll Get You' features a chord that he nicked from the Joan Baez song 'All My Trials'. Are there any other Beatles songs where the influence of a pre-existing recording is evident? Please reply direct to domuso@dircon.co.uk Thanks

Mar 21, 2001, 07:00 PM

My God, there are tons:

I Saw Her Standing There - Bass riff stolen from Chuck Berry's 1961 song "I'm Talking About You".

Ask Me Why - Reminiscent of Smokey Robinson's 1961 song "What's So Good About Goodbye".

Please Please Me - Chorus suggested by Bing Crosby's 1932 song "Please" (written by Leo Robin & Ralph Rainger).

Do You Want To Know A Secret? - Musical inspiration came from "I Really Love You", a 1961 hit for the Stereos. Also, some of the lyrics originated from "I'm Wishing" (Larry Morey & Frank Churchill), a song John's mother used to sing to him and one she picked up from Walt Disney's 1937 film Snow White And The Seven Dwarfs. (In one of the opening scenes, Snow White is working as a kitchen maid and, as she stands by the castle well, she begins to sing to the doves: "Wanna know a secret? Promise not to tell? We are standing by a wishing well."

There's A Place - Title derived from the West Side Story song "There's A Place For Us" (1957) which Paul had in his Forthlin Road record collection. Musically, the song was an attempt at a "Motown" sort of sound.

From Me To You - The use of the high-pitched "ooooh" sound was inspired by the Isley Brothers' recording of "Twist And Shout".

She Loves You - Paul's idea to switch the approach from writing about themselves (with the word "me") to writing about a love between two other people (with words "she and "you") stemmed from a song he had in his mind at the time, Bobby Rydell's then current British hit "Forget Him". The sixth chord which ends the song was also unusual in pop music, though the Glenn Miller Orchestra had used it often on their recordings in the 40s.

I'll Get You - As you mentioned, the shift from D to A minor to break the word "pretend" was taken from Joan Baez's version of the traditional song "All My Trials".

All I've Got To Do - Again, an attempt to do Smokey Robinson. The model used here was Smokey's "You Can Depend On Me".

Little Child - Part of the song's melody was inspired by "Whistle My Love", a 1950s song recorded by British folk singer Elton Hayes.

Hold Me Tight - Musically influenced by the work of the Shirelles, the New Jersey vocal group who in 1961 became the first all-girl group to make it to the No. 1 spot in the US charts. The Beatles often cited acts such as the Chiffons, Mary Wells, the Ronettes, the Donays and the Crystals as influences on their close harmony vocals.

I Wanna Be Your Man - Meant to emulate the feel of the Shirelles' song "Boys", which Ringo sang in concert. The dragged out "maaaan" of the chorus was inspired by Benny Spellman's song "Fortune Teller".

Not A Second Time - Musically inspired by Smokey Robinson and the Miracles. Part of it has also been compared to Gustav Mahler's "Song Of The Earth".

I Want To Hold Your Hand - John was intrigued by a contemporary French album of experimental music which had on it one track where a musical phrase repeated, as if the record had stuck. This effect was used in the song - "that my love, I can't hide, I can't hide, I can't hide".

This Boy - Inspired, as so much else was at the time, by Smokey Robinson and the Miracles. The middle eight was John trying to do Smokey.

Tell Me Why - John thought of something the Chiffons or the Shirelles might do and so went off and wrote this one.

Any Time At All - This was a rewriting of the Beatles' earlier song "Any Time At All", as John was to admit. There were only three other occasions when he claimed Beatles' songs had been recycled: "Yes It Is" he said was a rewrite of "This Boy", "Paperback Writer" was "Son of Day Tripper" and "Get Back" was a potboiler rewrite of "Lady Madonna".

When I Get Home - This was described by John as a "four-in-the-bar cowbell song", influenced by his love of Motown and American soul music.

You Can't Do That - The musical influence was Wilson Pickett, the former gospel singer from Alabama who had hits such as "Mustang Sally", "634-5789" and "In The Midnight Hour".

I'll Be Back - John found the chords for this while playing a Del Shannon song. This was probably "Runaway" which the Beatles had played in their early shows and which also starts in a minor chord and has a descending bass line.

I'm A Loser - Influenced (musically) by Bob Dylan.

No Reply - Based on "Silhouettes" (written by Bob Crewe and Frank Slaye), a big hit in 1957 for the Rays on Philadelphia's independent Cameo label. "Silhouttes" put a new twist on the old love cheat story: the boy discovers he is being two-timed by when he notices the silhouttes on the curtains of his lover's house. In "No Reply, as with "Silhouettes", he returns to her house and, watching from the shadows, sees her go in "with another man".

I'll Follow The Sun - Influenced by Buddy Holly's work.

I'm Down - An attempt to write a Little Richard sort of song.

You've Got To Hide Your Love Away - Bob Dylan's music directed John towards a more intense and personal style of writing, so he began to write songs in which his state of mind became the immediate starting point. The first lines of this song is a perfect description of this.

Day Tripper - Riff partly inspired by Bobby Parker's "Watch Your Step".

You Won't See Me - Paul had the Motwon sound in mind again here, particularly the melodic bass playing of James Jamerson, the legendary studio musician. It's also been suggested that the specific model he might have had in mind could have been "It's The Same Old Story" by the Four Tops.

Michelle - When Paul played the song to John he suggested the "I love you" in the middle section, specifying that the emphasis should fall on the word "love" each time. He was inspired here by Nina Simone's recording of "I Put A Spell On You", a hit in Britain during August 1965, where she had used the same phrase but placed the emphasis on the "you".

In My Life - The tune was inspired by the Mracles' "You Really Got A Hold On Me". The lyric bears resemblance to Charles Lamb's 18th Century poem, "The Old Familiar Faces", which John could well have come across in the popular poetry anthology Palgrave's Treasury. The poem starts:

I have had playmates, I have had companions,
In my days of childhood, in my joyful schooldays
-
All, all are gone, the old familiar faces.

Six verses later it ends:

How some they have died, and some they have left me,
And some taken from me; all are departed -
All, all are gone, the old familar faces.

If I Needed Someone - Tune inspired by two of the Byrds' tracks, "The Bells Of Rhymney" and "She Don't Care About Time".

Run For Your Life - John developed this from the line "I'd rather see you dead little girl than see you with another man" which occurred towards the end of Elvis Presley's 1955 Sun single "Baby, Let's Play House". It was originally written in 1954 by a 28-year-old preacher's son from Nashville named Arthur Gunter, who based the song on a 1951 country hit by Eddy Arnold, "I Want To Play House With You", and recorded it for the Excello label in late 1954.

Paperback Writer - The bass became the most prominent instrument on this track, bringing it into line with recent American recordings by Otis Redding and Wilson Pickett. The harmonies on this song were inspired by the Beach Boys' album Pet Sounds.

Here, There And Everywhere - When Paul recorded this, he imagined he light voice of Marianne Faithfull. He had recently heard the Beach Boys' newly-released album, Pet Sounds, which had impressed him because of its musical complexity and inventive vocal arrangements. Paul was particularly taken with the shimmering quality of "God Only Knows" and wanted to write something which captured the same mood.

Good Day Sunshine - Influenced by the Lovin' Spoonful, the New York-based group which had scored two American hits with "Do You Believe In Magic?" and "You Didn't Have To Be So Nice". The specific song that had inspired Paul that day was "Daydream", the Lovin' Spoonful's first British hit, which was in the Top 20 when the Beatles recorded Revolver in May 1966. Like "Good Day Sunshine", "Daydream" starts off with a choppy guitar beat before launching into a story of love-induced bliss heightened by beautiful weather: "I'm blowin' the day to take a walk in the sun, and fall on my face on somebody's new mown lawn".

Got To Get You Into My Life - Written by Paul, who had the idea of using brass in an attempt to emulate the Motown sound recently developed by Holland-Dozier-Holland with The Supremes.

When I'm Sixty-Four - A cabaret tune Paul composed out of respect for the music of the 20s and 30s, which his father had played as a young man.

Good Morning Good Morning - It was a television commercial for Kellog's Corn Flakes that gave John the title and chorus of this song. The commercial featured nothing more than corn flakes being tipped into a bowl with the four-line jingle: "Good morning, good morning, The best to you each morning, Sunshine breakfast, Kellog's Corn Flakes, Crisp and full of fun".

Your Mother Should Know - Another throwback to the music Paul's father enjoyed singing when he was a young man in Jim Mac's Jazz Band.

Lady Madonna - The piano line was taken from Johnny Parker's riff on "Bad Penny Blues", a 1956 hit in Britain for jazz trumpeter Humphrey Lyttelton, which had been produced by George Martin.

Back In The USSR - Written by Paul as a pastiche of the Beach Boys and Chuck Berry.

The Continuing Story Of Bungalow Bill - Tune based on "Stay As Sweet As You Are" which was written by Mack Gordon and Henry Revel and was used in the 1934 film College Rhythm.

Blackbird - Tune based on a piece by Bach which Paul had learned as a teenager.

Julia - The first two lines of the song are taken from Sand And Foam, a collection of proverbs by the Lebanese mystic, Kahlil Gibran, first published in 1927. The guitar work was influenced by Donovan.

Birthday - When Paul thumped out the basic tune for this he was thinking of "Happy, Happy Birthday", a 1957 hit in America for the Tuneweavers, but wanted to produce something which sounded contemporary and rock 'n' roll.

Mother Nature's Son - Paul wrote this with "Naure Boy" in mind, a song he had heard when he was younger, presumably the standard made popular by Nat 'King' Cole.

Helter Skelter - The concept for this song came from a music paper's rave review of a new single by the Who, "I Can See For Miles". Paul hadn't heard the single in question at the time, but the paper's comments made him want to create something which could provoke an equally powerful description ('swearing cymbals and cursing guitars,' something that would really 'freak people out').

Long Long Long - The chords were suggested to George by Bob Dylan's haunting track "Sad Eyed Lady Of The Lowlands", which had taken up one whole side of Dylan's 1966 double album Blonde On Blonde. George was fascinated with the movement from D to E minor to A and back to D and wanted to write something which sounded similar.

Cry Baby Cry - Partly based on the nursery rhyme "Sing A Song Of Sixpence", the song includes John's own creations the Duchess of Kirkcaldy and the King of Marigold. A few of the words he also got from another advert: "Cry baby cry, Make your mother buy".

I Me Mine - The waltz tune was inspired from music George heard being played by an Austrian marching band on a television broadcast.

The Long And Winding Road - Paul had the voice of Ray Charles in mind when he wrote this number and that this influenced the use of jazzy chords.

One After 909 - An attempt by John, in 1957, to write an American railroad song, in the style of skiffle hits such as "Last Train To San Fernando" by Johnny Duncan, "Cumberland Gap" and "Rock Island Line" by Lonnie Donegan and "Freight Train" by the Chas McDevitt Skiffle Group.

You Know My Name - Repeated in the style of the Four Tops' "Reach Out, I'll Be There".

Come Together - Two of the song lines referring to "old flat top" were lifted from Chuck Berry's "You Can't Catch Me" (John was later sued for plagiarism, he strenuously denied any musical theft).

Something - Its twin sources of inspiration were Ray Charles, who George imagined singing it, and a 1968 album track by James Taylor titled "Something In The Way She Moves".

Oh Darling - Inspired by the rock 'n' roll ballads of the late 50s, Jackie Wilson's in particular.

Because - The inspiration behind this song came from the first movement of Beethoven's Piano Sonata No. 14 in C Sharp Minor ('Moonlight Sonata').

Sun King - Influenced by Fleetwood Mac's "Albatross", a dreamy instrumental which had been a British Top 10 hit in the early part of 1969.

Golden Slumbers - From the traditional lullaby "Golden Slumbers" (written by English writer and dramatist Thomas Dekker, who was a contemporary of Shakespeare). Unable to read the music from the songbook, Paul went ahead and made up his own melody adding new words as he went along.

... Just to name a few. http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif

joe

Mar 21, 2001, 07:32 PM

a few? ALL KNOWLEDGE IS YOURS.

he's a real nowhere man!

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Harbidge

Mar 22, 2001, 06:32 AM

Just out of curiousity, do you have a girlfriend NowhereMan??? http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif

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Containing EVERY clue ever found about this conspiracy, Paul is Dead - The Conclusive Evidence (http://paulisdead.terrashare.com) will change your mind about this bizarre coverup.

Mar 22, 2001, 01:07 PM

Why yes, I sure do. She complains when I rattle off Beatle facts in my sleep though. http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif

Harbidge

Mar 22, 2001, 02:21 PM

What about when you rattle them off when you're awake?

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Containing EVERY clue ever found about this conspiracy, Paul is Dead - The Conclusive Evidence (http://paulisdead.terrashare.com) will change your mind about this bizarre coverup.

Mar 22, 2001, 02:25 PM

That's precisely when she sleeps. http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif

darkhorse

Mar 22, 2001, 05:58 PM

Nowhere Man:

1° how many books about The Beatles have you written? http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif

2° have you got to post them entirely in the Forum? http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif

3° thank you for doing it! http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif

4° get out of the Monthly Contest http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif

My complete admiration and congratulations for your deep knowledge.

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"The future still looks good..."

Mar 23, 2001, 01:25 AM

Darkhorse:

1. None as yet, though I have read a few. http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif Actually, I do have a burning ambition to one day write something that's in some way related to the Beatles.

2. Yes. http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/tongue.gif

3. You're most welcome, I like helping others out in any way I can. http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif

4. Next month you won't see a trace of me there, I promise. http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif

Thank you, and thank you again. http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/grin.gif

darkhorse

Mar 23, 2001, 05:49 PM

Just don't bore your girlfriend and future wife too much with that Beatle book. And try to send us an autographied copy of it when you publish it, right?

You're certainly welcome. Congrats again. http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/grin.gif

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"The future still looks good..."

darkhorse

Mar 23, 2001, 05:51 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Nowhere Man:
3. You're most welcome, I like helping others out in any way I can. http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That proves there might be a kind soul behind that irony and weird sense of humour that you have. And that kind of scares me. http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/tongue.gif

You might be the devil in disguise! http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif

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"The future still looks good..."

Mar 23, 2001, 06:21 PM

Well, I... er, I mean... the Devil was an angel before he turned to the 'dark side'. I guess we all like to go back to our roots. http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif

Mar 23, 2001, 06:22 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by darkhorse:
And try to send us an autographied copy of it when you publish it, right?

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Right, I'll do my best. http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif

bearkat77

Mar 23, 2001, 10:21 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Nowhere Man:
...before he turned to the 'dark side'<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Trust your feelings. http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif

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darkhorse

Mar 24, 2001, 10:34 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Nowhere Man:
My God, there are tons:
All I've Got To Do - Again, an attempt to do Smokey Robinson. The model used here was Smokey's "You Can Depend On Me".
I Want To Hold Your Hand - John was intrigued by a contemporary French album of experimental music which had on it one track where a musical phrase repeated, as if the record had stuck. This effect was used in the song - "that my love, I can't hide, I can't hide, I can't hide".
I'm A Loser - Influenced (musically) by Bob Dylan.
Michelle - When Paul played the song to John he suggested the "I love you" in the middle section, specifying that the emphasis should fall on the word "love" each time. He was inspired here by Nina Simone's recording of "I Put A Spell On You", a hit in Britain during August 1965, where she had used the same phrase but placed the emphasis on the "you".
Good Morning Good Morning - It was a television commercial for Kellog's Corn Flakes that gave John the title and chorus of this song. The commercial featured nothing more than corn flakes being tipped into a bowl with the four-line jingle: "Good morning, good morning, The best to you each morning, Sunshine breakfast, Kellog's Corn Flakes, Crisp and full of fun".
Back In The USSR - Written by Paul as a pastiche of the Beach Boys and Chuck Berry.
Because - The inspiration behind this song came from the first movement of Beethoven's Piano Sonata No. 14 in C Sharp Minor ('Moonlight Sonata').

Sun King - Influenced by Fleetwood Mac's "Albatross", a dreamy instrumental which had been a British Top 10 hit in the early part of 1969.

Golden Slumbers - From the traditional lullaby "Golden Slumbers" (written by English writer and dramatist Thomas Dekker, who was a contemporary of Shakespeare). Unable to read the music from the songbook, Paul went ahead and made up his own melody adding new words as he went along.

... Just to name a few. http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That were the only ones I knew before, Nowhere Man. Wanna know something? I printed your post. I always want to learn more. Especially about The Beatles. Thanks again, "little demon". http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif

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"The future still looks good..."

StuSutcliffe

Mar 25, 2001, 06:47 AM

And people complain about Oasis "borrowing" stuff? I think everyone else is jealous because Noel Gallagher's the only one since the Beatles clever enough to do it well.

Mar 25, 2001, 02:09 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by darkhorse:
That were the only ones I knew before, Nowhere Man. Wanna know something? I printed your post. I always want to learn more. Especially about The Beatles. Thanks again, "little demon". http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thank you again, darkhorse, for your kind sincerity. http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif

One question though, how do you know I'm "little"? http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif

Mar 25, 2001, 02:22 PM

Eleanor_rigby

Mar 25, 2001, 03:57 PM

My My MY you guy's Beatle Knowledge blows me away! I love the Beatles...I don't think that fact would be challenged...but I'm not a factoid person....So I admire those who are! Keep up the Brain work! http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/grin.gif

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Gotta visit THE site!
eleanor_rigby_97@hotmail.com

"Give us a Kiss"
"All you need is Love...Love is all you need."

darkhorse

Mar 25, 2001, 11:43 PM

I kind of agree with that. Not totally, though.

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"The future still looks good..."

darkhorse

Mar 27, 2001, 06:14 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Nowhere Man:
One question though, how do you know I'm "little"? http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I took the expression from a Fleetwood Mac song ("My Little Demon"). So it's indeed you the one that's talking about sizes... http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif Trust me I don't wanna know about that.

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"The future still looks good..."

darkhorse

Mar 31, 2001, 12:09 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by StuSutcliffe:
And people complain about Oasis "borrowing" stuff? I think everyone else is jealous because Noel Gallagher's the only one since the Beatles clever enough to do it well.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Here's my argument against that...

I was an Oasis fan before I became a huge Beatles fan, so I kind of know some of their songs. Apart from the obvious musical influences and textures, I'm going to do basically what Nowhere Man did with The Beatles' songs (doing a list) so that you can appreciate the Beatles' "influences" in their music, lyrics and videos.

1993 - Definitely Maybe

"Supersonic" - lyric: "you can sail with me/in my yellow submarine" (...)
"Live Forever" - video features picture of John Lennon

1995 - (What's The Story) Morning Glory?

"Hello" - uses spoken excerpts from radio programmes. John had used that in "I Am The Walrus". Paul re-used them in his "Back To The Egg" LP ("Reception" and "The Broadcast")
"Roll With It" - lyric: "don't let anybody get in your way/'cause it's all too much/for me to take" (...)
"Wonderwall" - title taken from the 1968 movie with a soundtrack album coming from George. The idea behind the song is practically the same as in the movie (you can only see the girl from a wonderwall)
"Don't Look Back In Anger" - piano intro copied from John's "Imagine"
Un-named 6 & 11 tracks - also use spoken excerpts from radio programmes.
"She's Electric" - "Beatle" vocal harmony finishes the song.
"Morning Glory" - lyric: "tomorrow never knows what it doesn't know too soon" (...)

During the supporting tour for this album, the band covered "I Am The Walrus" joined with a band formed by "Beatle look-alikes", and with a prominent picture of John Lennon in the background.
On their "MTV Unplugged" concert they performed "You've Got To Hide Your Love Away"

1997 - Be Here Now

"D'You Know What I Mean" - lyric: "the blood on the tracks must be mine/the fool on the hill and I feel fine" (...)
"My Big Mouth" - lyric: "down the long and winding road/back home to you" (...)
"Fade In-Out" - lyric: "get on the helter skelter/bowl in to the fray" (...)
"Be Here Now" - lyric: "sing a song from me/one from Let It Be" (...)
"All Around The World" - video suspiciously reminds the "Yellow Submarine" movie. The band flies through an animated world in a somewhat weird "flying saucer" http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/wink.gif
"It's Gettin' Better (Man!!)" - title? Nothing more to say.

After this album, I realized this band had no creativity. This is only copying. But still, it's one of the best things heard these days... http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif

1999 - Standing In The Shoulder Of Giants

"Go Let It Out" - video suspiciously reminds the "Magical Mystery Tour" movie
"Who Feels Love" - use of a sitar for a pop tune... http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif

Alright, it's enough. I think my point was well-taken.

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"The future still looks good..."

darkhorse

Mar 31, 2001, 12:10 PM

Oh and that's why I only kind of agreed with Stu's opinion (Sorry Stu http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif)

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"The future still looks good..."

joe

Apr 01, 2001, 10:45 PM

i agree stu.
somebody has to build on the foundation.
where's klatu?

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Ah Dunno

Apr 27, 2001, 06:01 PM

As an amateur songwriter myself, I'd say it's impossible to escape influences. "My Sweet Lord" could have been an honest mistake. I've jammed all nite thinking I had something, and the next day realized it was a bossa nova version of the "Star Spangled Banner."
Say -- that quaver in Paul's voice toward the end of "I've just Seen a Face"?
Folksong, right? Listen to Dylan's first album. It was definitely a mannerism of his then. McCartney just used a hint of it, just a trace. The guy's an uncanny mimic. He could probably do Lennon better than Lennon himself.

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jtal909

Apr 28, 2001, 05:54 AM

I cannot see how George lifted anything from He's So fine. Sub consciously at best.

[This message has been edited by jtal909 (edited April 28, 2001 at 06:55 AM).]

SleepyHead

Apr 28, 2001, 08:54 AM

I've never gotten it, myself... I simply do not hear/see what was "borrowed" from "He's So Fine"... So sue me... http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/frown.gif

http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/sleep2.gif

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