Got Veggies?

[Jeni]

I've been a vegetarian for most of my life and some asked me today if I was veggie because of Paul McCartney. I'm not, but I think that some people could be from hearing about it through Paul.

So I pass the question on to you.. are any of you guys veggie? Because of Paul? Why or Why not?

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Jeni

Let it Be

[bearkat77]

There's no way I could do that. I'm a "meat & potatoes" man.

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Bearkat77's Beatlemaniac Page (http://www9.50megs.com/bearkat77)

[jami]

Me too Kat. With as small as I am, you would swear I was a veggie eater only. No way...I'll be a cavelady until the end!

[Jeni]

First of sorry I posted this on the wrong forum.. anyway to move it?

My whole family are hunter people, my mom has the dear horns and marlan bills on the walls to prove it. I don't mind how she eats because she eats all game and the beef, chicken, and sheep, from her fiance's small ranch.

I don't mind that stuff at all but industrial meat is yucky. Oh.. and to tie Beatles stuff into this post:
Linda McCartney cookbooks are wonderful. I'm not just saying that either there is info. on all the different types of food and grains and stuff, even if your not a veggie one of her books is a must!




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Jeni

Let it Be

[jami]

Jeni...I've been wanting to get some of her cookbooks. I love to cook. Yeah, I like my veggies too...just not into the tofu thing. Yuck!

[jtal909]

Nothing like a good burger sometimes.

[Lucy]

I'm veggie (when I'm not anaemic) and it has nothing to do with Paul or Linda. People always seem to think it has but I mean really! It's a huge life-style change that can have a big effect on your health - as I've found! - and can't really be taken on lightly.

[Jeni]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Tahoma, Arial, Sans-Serif">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jami:
I love to cook. Yeah, I like my veggies too...just not into the tofu thing. Yuck!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You know though, I *rarely* eat tofu! I don't like it much either. But it makes good dairless shakes!

Lucy- when you say vegging affects your health do you mean negativly or positivly?
It's improved my health tons!



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Jeni

Let it Be

[bearkat77]

I don't like hair in my shakes either.

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Bearkat77's Beatlemaniac Page (http://www9.50megs.com/bearkat77)

[HeyBeatle]

I tried to be a veggie once cause it's supposed to make you healthier. Well that lasted for about, oh, half a week. The chorus I was in that year went to burger king for lunch after a choral festival and the smell of the charcoaling burgers was much more than I could take. I ended up eating a burger and never going back to being a veggie. Besides I don't much like veggie loaf and tofu among other things.

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" Are you a mod or a rocker?"
" No I'm a mocker."

" Go to the window... Go to the window."

"Oh won't you please, please help me!"-Fred

[Lucy]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Tahoma, Arial, Sans-Serif">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jeni:


when you say vegging affects your health do you mean negativly or positivly?
It's improved my health tons!

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Jeni, I was one of those crazy types that just cut out all meat and didn't supplement with anything. As a result I got horribly anaemic and I still am 7 years later. I am a little more sensible now. Back then I went about it in the wrong way - I did cleansing fasts and other weird things like that so the affects on my health have been a bit negative. I only have myself to blame though! I have learnt my lesson and I am far more cautious now.

[Jeni]

Lucy- Yeah that's definitly not the way to go about it! http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif When I went veg seriously I cut out all meats except fish and game meat. Also, living in Oregon, all of the meat here comes from small local farms so the industrial crap isn't in it.
Now I very rarely eat fish, only if there is no other option. The hardest things for me to cut out have been jello and rice crispy treats.. YUMMY!
I'm going to Alaska today so eating veggie is going to be mega hard.. caribou, salmon, and bear OH MY!

Anyway,


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Jeni

Let it Be

[iFrog]

I'm a veggie. Been that way for almost three years. Don't regret a single day of it. It is partly because of Paul and Linda, yes. http://www.beatlelinks.net/ubb/smilies/images/icons/smile.gif

[iFrog]

I am still a veggie and i admire Pauls work with Peta. His latest is here: Sir Paul McCartney Ditches Cruel Charities (http://blog.peta.org/archives/2007/07/sir_paul_mccart.php)

[kmac]

How long after converting before you no longer desired meat?

What foods helped in satisfying the desire to eat meat during the conversion period or was it just mind over matter that pushed you through?

I am getting closer to removing meat from my diet - maybe twice a month I eat meat, usually less - but I would have a hard time giving up cheeses and cow's milk for cereal, so Vegan is probably not in the cards for me.

[Hari's Chick]

Awesome, you're veggie for about 9 years now? That's 9 x 88 lives~ you've saved 792 lives. Meat eaters kill an average off 88 lives per year... (living beating hearts with real nervous systems and emotions, including the fear they all have before their slaughter).

I'm vegan for years now and very supportive of Paul's causes. It's great he makes this statement. The thing about cancer research is that many people would volunteer to be the human experiements when their cancer is somewhat advanced. With all those people, giving animals cancer just to experiement makes no sense.

Good for Paul!

[oldbeatlechick]

My husband and I went Veggie in the 1975 but nothing to do with Paul and Linda, it was more because of the way animals were farmed and treated. We bought up two healthy boys on a vegetarian diet and were still veggie until 3 years ago when we began to eat meat again, not sure why it happened really after 29 years.
We are gradually returning to our veggie diet, as I do feel guilty at times when eating meat or fish.
One of my bug bears is people calling themselves vegetarians when they eat fish and sometimes eat meat?? :thinker:

[iFrog]

Awesome, you're veggie for about 9 years now? That's 9 x 88 lives~ you've saved 792 lives. Meat eaters kill an average off 88 lives per year... (living beating hearts with real nervous systems and emotions, including the fear they all have before their slaughter).

I'm vegan for years now and very supportive of Paul's causes. It's great he makes this statement. The thing about cancer research is that many people would volunteer to be the human experiements when their cancer is somewhat advanced. With all those people, giving animals cancer just to experiement makes no sense.

Good for Paul!Well that's great Haris' Chick. I was hoping that there were some fellow vegans on this board. I have been vegan for over 5 years now. Yeah good point about the vivisection and animal experimentation, it is just plain wrong and unscientific. Impossible to justify.

My husband and I went Veggie in the 1975 but nothing to do with Paul and Linda, it was more because of the way animals were farmed and treated. We bought up two healthy boys on a vegetarian diet and were still veggie until 3 years ago when we began to eat meat again, not sure why it happened really after 29 years.
We are gradually returning to our veggie diet, as I do feel guilty at times when eating meat or fish.
One of my bug bears is people calling themselves vegetarians when they eat fish and sometimes eat meat?? :thinker: Yeah, fishitarians, flexitarians whatever they call themselves, it's pretty pathetic. I know that i could never go back to my meat eating ways, i don't see how you can.

And kmac there is tons of information out there about veganism and vegetarianism. I suggest you do some research, you might be very surprised as i was.

[Asha]

I'm vegetarian as well, but it has nothing to do with Paul or the Beatles.

I tried to go veggie back in the 80s & couldn't resist chicken! & of course, once I ate that, I craved other meats again. But eventually had to do without the meat & it's so unlike people think. There are so many foods you can eat. Sometimes it may not be convenient... for example, most fast food places don't have much you can order... but there's SO much you can eat! I barely scratch the surface. & no, I'm not a big tofu lover. Being vegetarian doesn't mean you have to eat seeds & lettuce all the time. :laugh5:

[iFrog]

That's nice, glad you stuck with it. And you're right, being veggie is so easy.

[VersusBatman]

I'm a meat eater.

[iFrog]

That's not good for the animals, for the environment and for your health.

[VersusBatman]

I respect that you feel that way, but I don't see anything wrong with eating meat.

[iFrog]

I respect that you feel that way, but I don't see anything wrong with eating meat.I disagree. I don't see anything right about eating meat. It is wasteful, the animals are treated poorly and are raised and confined in horrendous appalling conditions, eating animal proteins has been linked with numerous diseases and is unhealthy, and it is harmful to the environment.

[VersusBatman]

Then I'll agree to disagree.

[iFrog]

There you go. I'm not a meat eater.

[VersusBatman]

I do see the health benefits, but being a granddaughter of a farmer, I was raised differently.

I eat mostly poultry. I gave up ground beef long time ago. I use ground turkey now. I eat dark greens. I won't allow iceberg lettuce. It has no nutritional value and i don't likethe taste or lack of it. White bread isn't allowed either.

[iFrog]

Eating meat is barbaric and cruel. It doesn't matter how one was raised, it's just plain wrong and unhealthy.

[sourmilkpinky]

Rahill? is that you?

I love meat...not so much animals.

[Lady Madonna]

I think red meat is disgusting, always have. Something about the texture just grosses me out. But there is no way I could ever give up chicken and fish.

[Hari's Chick]

Rahill? is that you?

I love meat...not so much animals.



As iFrog correctly points out, it is also very harmful to the environment. Those who want to see the environment presevered for future generations might do well to consider the ramifications of meat eating as well. It makes sense even for the anthropocentic.

For those inclined to disagree, please do so respectfully. It is very hurtful to see posts which appear taunting.

[VersusBatman]

Rahill? is that you?

I love meat...not so much animals.

Who?

For those inclined to disagree, please do so respectfully. It is very hurtful to see posts which appear taunting.
Thank you. If one expect people to consider their points of view, name calling isn't the way to go.

[Hari's Chick]

Who?



Rahil was another vegetarian who was on the forum years ago. No point discussing members who aren't here to speak for themselves, I think.. Also iFrog will not know Rahil, so it makes for a potentially uncomfortable situation for him.

[VersusBatman]

Nevermind then.

[ringo_rama]

One thing that confuses me--serious question here--I know of some vegetarians who refuse to eat any animals, and then I understand there are some that eat fish and whatnot. What's the deal? Is it like a land-dwelling animals only thing for some people?

Until cows, pigs, chickens, and fish are put on the endangered species list, I'll continue to enjoy them and their deliciousness.

I don't have a problem with most vegetarians--what you do with your body is up to you. It's the ones who complain to meat eaters that we're killing ourselves/being unnecessarily cruel/supporting animal cruelty/etc. that give the group a bad name IMHO.

Michael: "Since when are you against leather?"
Maeby: "Yeah, you're not even a vegetarian."
Lindsay: "I'm not against the insides. People need meat to survive."

[Hari's Chick]

It's certainly fine to ask, vb. :smile1: But just to stay respectful to iFrog..

Back to the topic .... :smile1:

http://www.peta.org/feat/paulmveg/

[VersusBatman]

One thing that confuses me--serious question here--I know of some vegetarians who refuse to eat any animals, and then I understand there are some that eat fish and whatnot. What's the deal? Is it like a land-dwelling animals only thing for some people?

Those people aren't true vegetarians. They avoid red meat for health reasons.

Until cows, pigs, chickens, and fish are put on the endangered species list, I'll continue to enjoy them and their deliciousness.

Can't argue with that.

I don't have a problem with most vegetarians--what you do with your body is up to you. It's the ones who complain to meat eaters that we're killing ourselves/being unnecessarily cruel/supporting animal cruelty/etc. that give the group a bad name IMHO.

I agree. Saying those kind of things builds up a defense.

The Simpsons;

Lisa: Why can't all those fools realize you can live perfectly by eating fruit, vegetables, grain and milk.

Apu: Oh! You eat dairy?

Lisa: You don't eat dairy?

Apu: I do not consume any part of an animal.

Lisa: You must think I'm a monster.

Apu: Yes I do.

[kmac]

The fast food industry changed everything in regards to animal harvesting. The conditions in which cows, pigs, and chickens are raised is appalling. The fast food industries dictate the manner in which our animal food supply is raised because they wield the most monetary control.

The cattle farms are forced to maximize their marginal profits by raising animals in extremely close quarters amongst their own waste products. In addition the cattle are fed with portions of the remains of slaughter, again to maximize marginal profits.

The waste that is generated from these animal farms are an environmental nightmare of massive proportions.

If anyone is interested in further reading on this topic, I highly recommend The Fast Food Nation which does a good job of revealing some of the behind the scenes operations of the multi-billion dollar fast food industry. A classic example of the tail wagging the dog.

I too struggle with occasional needs to consume meat, mostly poultry. But after becoming more aware of the tactics used to deliver low cost fast food, I am on a fast track to swear off the industry from my further patronage. But it is difficult I must admit.

[Hari's Chick]

Until cows, pigs, chickens, and fish are put on the endangered species list, I'll continue to enjoy them and their deliciousness.

I don't have a problem with most vegetarians--what you do with your body is up to you. It's the ones who complain to meat eaters that we're killing ourselves/being unnecessarily cruel/supporting animal cruelty/etc. that give the group a bad name IMHO.




This is the type of taunting post which i am asking you to avoid.

I believe Lord Krishna is within each soul... animal and human equally. To refer to 'deliciousess' is not respectful. You can disagree without being taunting. Please be respectful. Thank you.

[Hari's Chick]

One thing that confuses me--serious question here--I know of some vegetarians who refuse to eat any animals, and then I understand there are some that eat fish and whatnot. What's the deal? Is it like a land-dwelling animals only thing for some people?

Until cows, pigs, chickens, and fish are put on the endangered species list, I'll continue to enjoy them and their deliciousness.

I don't have a problem with most vegetarians--what you do with your body is up to you. It's the ones who complain to meat eaters that we're killing ourselves/being unnecessarily cruel/supporting animal cruelty/etc. that give the group a bad name IMHO.

Michael: "Since when are you against leather?"
Maeby: "Yeah, you're not even a vegetarian."
Lindsay: "I'm not against the insides. People need meat to survive."

I do not understand why meat eaters always go defensive and must post on veggie threads.


Vaisnavas hold ALL life equal to Christ. Do you see?

[VersusBatman]

To be perfectly honest, if given the choice between meat and sugar, I'd give up meat.

I love my sweets.

[ringo_rama]

I apologize if you found my post offensive--wasn't my intention. I didn't really think the word "deliciousness" was taunting, just additional commentary. But the reason for being "defensive" is in response to iFrog's comments. It's a two-way street. Like I said, if you want to be a vegetarian, that's cool. Saying that I'm "barbaric and cruel" and "just plain wrong" for eating meat? Not so cool.

Vaisnavas hold ALL life equal to Christ. Do you see?

That's fine, I respect that, although I disagree. It's not a subject I know a whole lot about so I can't really give you much more of a response.

To be perfectly honest, if given the choice between meat and sugar, I'd give up meat.

I love my sweets.

Oh, totally. Hell, if they had all the necessary vitamins and minerals, I could live on an all-Tootsie Roll diet.

[VersusBatman]

Chocolate comes from a plant. So does sugar.

[oldbeatlechick]

Hey folks what happened to live and let live!!

We need to respect everyone here, we all have different views. As you will have seen from my previous post we were veggie for 29years and then started eating meat again, admittedly we are now back to veggie, but I don't think we should think badly of our meat eating friends! They have choices too, and yes after so many years I know all the arguments against vegetarianism, you should have heard them in 1975 when vegetarianism wasn't accepted as a normal. We had all the weird and wonderful arguments against vegetarianism especially when bringing up our 2 boys, who by the way are both over 6' and now one eats meat the other doesn't and are in their 20's.
We don't want to go down the route of persecuting people for their beliefs because they don't agree with ours!! :nono5:

So please remember we have compassion for all living things, that includes other human beings!!
:peace: :peace: :peace:

Sorry if I have upset anyone it's not my intention.

[iFrog]

Rahil was another vegetarian who was on the forum years ago. No point discussing members who aren't here to speak for themselves, I think.. Also iFrog will not know Rahil, so it makes for a potentially uncomfortable situation for him.Thanks for the info Hari's Chick. No it doesn't make me uncomfortable, it's good to know that someone else has been here before myself to make the connection about eating meat, harming the environment and the brutal and cruel treatment of animals.

[iFrog]

I do not understand why meat eaters always go defensive and must post on veggie threads.


Vaisnavas hold ALL life equal to Christ. Do you see?Excellent point.

[iFrog]

I apologize.Apology accepted, if the apology was directed at me. I didn't really think the word "deliciousness" was taunting,It was. You're putting a base desire over the welfare and happiness of animals, ignoring compassion and ethical considerations. But the reason for being "defensive" is in response to iFrog's comments.Yes. Saying that I'm "barbaric and cruel" and "just plain wrong" for eating meat? You have either misquoted me or misinterpreted my rather harmless and direct statement. I said the action of mindlessly consuming animal products, including eating them for dinner, was barbaric and cruel and just plain wrong. I can substantiate this statement if necessary.

[Asha]

I eat mostly poultry. I gave up ground beef long time ago. I use ground turkey now. I eat dark greens. I won't allow iceberg lettuce. It has no nutritional value and i don't likethe taste or lack of it. White bread isn't allowed either.

Oh I agree VB! I grew up on iceberg & now never touch it. It really has no taste compared to the other greens! & we always had white bread, but I don't keep that in the house now either. Funny how I've changed over the years. :laugh5:

[VersusBatman]

Oh I agree VB! I grew up on iceberg & now never touch it. It really has no taste compared to the other greens! & we always had white bread, but I don't keep that in the house now either. Funny how I've changed over the years. :laugh5:
I never liked white bread, but what really changed my mind was when I had gestational diabetes. That stuff really rasies your blood sugar. And a rule of thumb when it comes to greens: the darker the better.

Just an FYI. I just found out that some cornbread mixes have lard in them. So it's better buy cornmeal and make your own.

[Asha]

Just an FYI. I just found out that some cornbread mixes have lard in them. So it's better buy cornmeal and make your own.

Oh that's good to know, too! I don't make it often, but when I do, I like to put jalapenos or green chilies in my corn bread! :drool:

[VersusBatman]

I put whole corn in mine.

[Asha]

Wooo, never tried that! I'll have to remember to try it next time I make some! Thanks for the tip! :teeth1:

[Hari's Chick]

Hey folks what happened to live and let live!!

We don't want to go down the route of persecuting people for their beliefs because they don't agree with ours!! :nono5:

So please remember we have compassion for all living things, that includes other human beings!!
:peace: :peace: :peace:

Sorry if I have upset anyone it's not my intention.

Were my words harsh? I am sorry if I was injurious. I try to speak my Truth without being injurious. Since this is a highly emotive topic for me, my whole heart tends to feel ripped out when I think of animals dying. I appologize though if I have gone... beyond being truthful.... and gone into offensive.

[Hari's Chick]

That's fine, I respect that, although I disagree. It's not a subject I know a whole lot about so I can't really give you much more of a response.
Oh, totally. Hell, if they had all the necessary vitamins and minerals, I could live on an all-Tootsie Roll diet.

hey hey! Here's a little info on Vaisnaviam and why we are veggies. :smile1:

http://www.radhadesh.com/index.php?id=43

LOL If I could live on Hot Tamales I would, too. Or popcorn!

[oldbeatlechick]

No offense taken and as a family we have in the past been involved in some very strong discussions with friends and family over the issue of vegetarianism. I have to say they were all shocked when we went back to eating meat, and will probably find it strange that my husband and I have reverted back to vegetarianism again in the last couple of weeks, but I cannot get away from the guilt I feel. :sad1:

So I do understand your passion and do not hold it against you as I have been there and done that! :teeth1:

I do think however that a more subtle approach works better! :wink2:

:heart1: & :peace:

[Hari's Chick]

obc, so you and your hubby are going back to vegetarianism?

[oldbeatlechick]

obc, so you and your hubby are going back to vegetarianism?

Yes I did mention in the first post that we have now reverted back to being veggie! So our friends will have to get used to it again.

Our eldest son was veggie to the age of 17/18 and is now 28 and not veggie any more, although he likes the veggie meals I cook! The other son is 24 and still prefers to be veggie.

It is so much easier to be vegetarian these days, you are not considered a freak or strange as we were in the 70's.

:peace:

[Asha]

LOL If I could live on Hot Tamales I would, too.

:siesta: A girl after my own heart! :heart1:

[Asha]

It is so much easier to be vegetarian these days, you are not considered a freak or strange as we were in the 70's.

:peace:

I've noticed that as well! Much easier here in the States than it was 20 years ago when I first attempted. :laugh5: Still waiting for some of the good yummy things that the UK has that we haven't got! :drool:

[Rellevart]

I do not understand why meat eaters always go defensive and must post on veggie threads.

I tend to find it's the veggies who get more defensive, actually. I don't think I've ever met a meat eater who's tried to convert a veggie, but veggies try to convert meat eaters all the time. I don't believe "statistics" on either side because you can find any statistic to support anything you want, if you look hard enough. I'm not a veggie, though I probably eat about 75% veggie meals, but as soon as somebody starts running towards me screaming "YOU EVIL HORRIBLE SLAUGHTERING HORRIBLE HORRRIBLE EVIL EVIL EVIL PERSON", that totally turns me off and makes me want to do the opposite of what they want me to do. There are better ways to get one's message across than being accusatory. (These comments are not personally directed towards you, HC, just because I quoted you...wanted to make sure you knew that. :smile1:)

[Because]

I tend to find it's the veggies who get more defensive, actually. I don't think I've ever met a meat eater who's tried to convert a veggie, but veggies try to convert meat eaters all the time. I don't believe "statistics" on either side because you can find any statistic to support anything you want, if you look hard enough. I'm not a veggie, though I probably eat about 75% veggie meals, but as soon as somebody starts running towards me screaming "YOU EVIL HORRIBLE SLAUGHTERING HORRIBLE HORRRIBLE EVIL EVIL EVIL PERSON", that totally turns me off and makes me want to do the opposite of what they want me to do. There are better ways to get one's message across than being accusatory. (These comments are not personally directed towards you, HC, just because I quoted you...wanted to make sure you knew that. :smile1:)

I love it when you eat bloody flesh, personally.

[ringo_rama]

I don't think I've ever met a meat eater who's tried to convert a veggie, but veggies try to convert meat eaters all the time. I don't believe "statistics" on either side because you can find any statistic to support anything you want, if you look hard enough.

Exactly. 83% of all statistics are made up.

[Hari's Chick]

Exactly. 83% of all statistics are made up.

I'm telling my college stat teacher you said that! :tongue1:

[Hari's Chick]

I tend to find it's the veggies who get more defensive, actually. I don't think I've ever met a meat eater who's tried to convert a veggie, but veggies try to convert meat eaters all the time. I don't believe "statistics" on either side because you can find any statistic to support anything you want, if you look hard enough. I'm not a veggie, though I probably eat about 75% veggie meals, but as soon as somebody starts running towards me screaming "YOU EVIL HORRIBLE SLAUGHTERING HORRIBLE HORRRIBLE EVIL EVIL EVIL PERSON", that totally turns me off and makes me want to do the opposite of what they want me to do. There are better ways to get one's message across than being accusatory. (These comments are not personally directed towards you, HC, just because I quoted you...wanted to make sure you knew that. :smile1:)

Believe me, meat eaters get aggressive towards vegetarians all the time.

I just find whenever a veggie thread is going, meat eaters tend to post about how meat eating is okay. Why? I do not understand that. If I started a thread about "elder abuse is wrong"... would it be okay for some posters to say "old people are annoying"? Or if I wrote "sad findings on the holocaust".. would it be an invitation for white male supremists to say it was exaggerated?

Maybe the reason we vegetarians feel emotive about the subject is that I do not "like" animals... I really love them. I love them and they are helpless. Have you ever been in a situaiton where you felt helpless? It sucks.

If you saw someone hitting someone for being Jewish... or killing an elderly person because they wanted something from them... doesn't that make you sad, Rell? Well, I feel just as sad seeing an innocent animal's life taken when there are other options available. There is no "good" reason to kill and eat animals. You say statistics are fabricated. When George was ill, I read a lot frm Mayo Clinic for example. Heaps on eliminating meat there ~ soas to avoid cancer and heart disease.

If you decide to eat meat or not... or if you eat meat as a reaction to vegetarian commentary... well, then what are my options? When I see a thread about killing creatures I happen to feel emotional about ... should I tenper my voice or opionions so as not to offend? Is that speaking my truth or compromising? My goal is not to offend, my goal is not to drive you into Ronald McDonalds arms... yet... am I expected to alter my soul's truth for other's comfort levels? If that is so, on what philosophical level does that stop? So...I should not be emotive for animals.... am I allowed to be for
misogynists? White supremists? If we must temper our Spiritual Truths as we understand them... who's dialogue are we following?

I fel sorry you are inclined to 'react' into meat eating. That is a shame. All I can say is that Sri Yukteswar said ... when one feels critisized, introspect to see if there is truth in what is being said. If you feel there is truth, do not be afraid to change and fear your sense of self is shaken in admitting you have been wrong. If you feel you are right, then you can remain cmfortable with your sense of self. You will evolve as you see spiritually necessary. You will grow according to your own truth. I suggest to be open to the dialogue of descenting opionions without just reacting.

Maybe you will say I am reacting. I have examined this for many years and follow what I know to be my truth. Vegetarianism. In my religion talking about eating animals is as bad as sacreligious acts against Christ. In my religion, all souls are sacred.

I do not really know what more to say. Even hearing about people eating meat... makes me so sad. I tend to hate veggie threads for that very reason. Still, I feel it necessary to speak on behalf of the creatuers who cannot speak for themselves. (My kitten is looking at me like he is proud of me right now....)

[Hari's Chick]

http://www.hinduwisdom.info/images/Krishna_ecology.jpg

[Hari's Chick]

http://www.bhagavad-gita.org/Images/cow-gomatha_vishnu.gif

http://www.srimadbhagavatam.org/images/krishna/reposing-with-animals.jpg


http://www.goshala.com/img/cows02.jpg


http://www.goshala.com/img/cows05.jpg

[VersusBatman]

Well normally I wouldn't post in a pro-veggie thread, but the person who started it did ask:

So I pass the question on to you.. are any of you guys veggie? Because of Paul? Why or Why not?

I didn't think I needed a flame proof suit. ;)

I would never wave a piece of meat in your face and tell you to get over it. I would never serve you meat or take you somewhere where meat is served. Just like I would hate it if someone smoked in my house or tried to serve me alcohol.

But the important question is, why is this thread still in the music section?

[Hari's Chick]

I didn't think I needed a flame proof suit. ;)

i am sorry you feel I flamed you. I am not feeling aggressive. Actually, I am feeling the opposite- sad.

[Because]

Really think.

08BRy0MoIA8

[Hari's Chick]

The fast food industry changed everything in regards to animal harvesting. The conditions in which cows, pigs, and chickens are raised is appalling. The fast food industries dictate the manner in which our animal food supply is raised because they wield the most monetary control.

The cattle farms are forced to maximize their marginal profits by raising animals in extremely close quarters amongst their own waste products. In addition the cattle are fed with portions of the remains of slaughter, again to maximize marginal profits.

The waste that is generated from these animal farms are an environmental nightmare of massive proportions.

If anyone is interested in further reading on this topic, I highly recommend The Fast Food Nation which does a good job of revealing some of the behind the scenes operations of the multi-billion dollar fast food industry. A classic example of the tail wagging the dog.

I too struggle with occasional needs to consume meat, mostly poultry. But after becoming more aware of the tactics used to deliver low cost fast food, I am on a fast track to swear off the industry from my further patronage. But it is difficult I must admit.

excellent points

[FPSHOT]

Nice to see you two agree again :smile1:

Lorraine, I believe you have raised "quote" .. excellent points.. "unquote" on this thread here.

There will never be a time that the world will exist of only veggie people or non veggie people..

Yet, to tell the world about the value of animal life is important. Many have been convinced by listening and thinking about it.

All the Yogis of the Himalayas have done it for centuries and have not been able to keep all of the non-veggie population to change their life style.

But to at least continue to point out how any form of life is life is what also the Gurus have done.

Respect between the two sides and some form of understanding is essential. We have had threads like this before and I think compared to earlier ones, this one is a rather nice example of conversation. It just remains to be a touchy issue.

[FPSHOT]

Exactly. 83% of all statistics are made up.

it would not surprise me if the % is even higher.

Anyone can set up a website and shout things.

[FPSHOT]

I tend to find it's the veggies who get more defensive, actually. I don't think I've ever met a meat eater who's tried to convert a veggie, but veggies try to convert meat eaters all the time.

I think that the word "defensive" is not really the way to say it. It seems logical to me that the convincing part is at the veggie side for the reasons outlined here in this thread. Just like it is with smokers who will not really encourage non-smokers to start smoking and the same with many other examples.

[kmac]

Speaking from my own past experiences, when approached by well meaning Veggies and presented with logical pro arguments, I feel a sense of guilt which sometimes manifests itself into defensiveness for my meat eating ways.I shouldn't feel guilty, like millions of others I was raised a meat eater.

But, the more I educate myself, the more assured I become of my need to make changes in my diet and do all that I can to no longer support certain business practices of the food industry. All the while on my path, I try to not lose my objectivity because I do realize that nearly all information is presented with bias.

My education continues.

[iFrog]

I think that the word "defensive" is not really the way to say it. It seems logical to me that the convincing part is at the veggie side for the reasons outlined here in this thread. Just like it is with smokers who will not really encourage non-smokers to start smoking and the same with many other examples.Apples and oranges FPSHOT. Before i became a vegan i was an omnivore. I know from personal experience that the objections and complaints raised as rebuttals are insubstantial and irrelevant at best. And if i may... I also find it a bit curious that there are perhaps others here that seek relief and attempt to frame these disagreements only in an "us versus them" fashion.

But your observations are spot on.

As for others bemoaning the inaccuracy and fallibility of statistics, some things need to be said here.

There is a difference between what is commonly called descriptive statistics and what is best considered disinformation, misinformation, propaganda and distortions, and the sources that would disseminate such false and misleading statements. After all it is hard mathematical science. So while i laugh at the apparent absurdity of ones closing ones eyes and blaming flawed statistics for all that appears to be in error in this world, and for passing judgement upon others, i cry that someone would think this important and necessary, instead of thinking of the animals.

[FPSHOT]

Apples and oranges FPSHOT. Before i became a vegan i was an omnivore. I know from personal experience that the objections and complaints raised as rebuttals are insubstantial and irrelevant at best. And if i may... I also find it a bit curious that there are perhaps others here that seek relief and attempt to frame these disagreements only in an "us versus them" fashion.

Apples and oranges are both good food and are both fruit and both mostly round.. :smile2:

but you missed my point probably which can be my writing. What I try to say is that on this thread people write who are vegan or veggie or who are non of both. And some of the vegetarians/vegan explain about the how and why that they became one…. And again I say…b e c a m e

To say something IS insubstantial and irrelevant to me mostly is not more than a personal observation and not a written definition each person whill agree on. I do understand what you mean, but in my opinion what you consider insubstantial and irrelevant can be the total oposite of my 'experiences' towards rebuttals (thanks for the new word, never heard of it)

Now… the original question was if ‘we’ became veggie/vegan because of Paul.

Well, for instance myself… No absolutely not. I became vegetarian because I listened to explanations about things I did not know. And for instance the things Hari’s Chick writes here are the ones which made me veggie. Because of the way it is presented, just like the Yogis of the Himalayas have done it for centuries... in good harmony and without pressure.

George never told anyone "you MUST read about the Eastern Philosphy".. he gave people books to read and he gave us "My Sweet Lord" which was so new to the Western World in 1970 and is so common now in music thanks to him. How many people were vegan in 1953 and how many are now and how does that come? Mouth to mouth conversations. (I don't want answers about the numbers btw LOL)

So my point is not about having two sides, or comparing it to other issues, but.. to explain that if you do not start a conversation about things, nothing changes, just like in the other issues I mentioned.

Had I not known what I learned, I would maybe still be what you and probably most of the people here were or are .. non-veggie/vegan.

Sure, I can forget the apples and oranges and write like you did and say “Eating meat is barbaric and cruel. It doesn't matter how one was raised, it's just plain wrong and unhealthy.” If I am right you are vegetarian since about 1989, so before all that – unless it is your birthyear - maybe you fitted in your own description also about it’s environmental aspects and about thinking of animals? I don’t mean this rude, but those remarks in conversations like this would never have even make me think of becoming a vegetarian. It probably would have turned me away from reading the thread.

So, something made you change and that is also for instance what Hari's Chick is trying to explain... sharing information...

And you know…I really am not here to raise fingers and say what people should eat, I don’t give a toss to be honest, but just like in all the other discussions here it is good to learn and share and that was the reason behind my post and as for statistics ... yes Information is much more important than numbers and that is what is shown here in some posts. Just to learn from it and think.

[iFrog]

Apples and oranges are both good food and are both fruit and both mostly round.. :smile2:Thank you FPSHOT. Good points to be brutally honest i misread your post as being nothing more than a watered down endorsement of the rather listless and unprovoked veggie bashing going on in this thread.

but you missed my point probably which can be my writing. What I try to say is that on this thread people write who are vegan or veggie or who are non of both. And some of the vegetarians/vegan explain about the how and why that they became one…. And again I say…b e c a m e[Again thanks for the response, i appreciate your honesty. And again i plead that i misread your reply, and posted what amounted to an emotional reply. I missed the twist you put on the word became, for various reasons.

To say something IS insubstantial and irrelevant to me mostly is not more than a personal observation and not a written definition each person whill agree on. I do understand what you mean, but in my opinion what you consider insubstantial and irrelevant can be the total oposite of my 'experiences' towards rebuttals (thanks for the new word, never heard of it) Excellent point, thanks for taking the time to explain this to me. I am basically just trying to say in a sugar coated and very round-about fashion that the others have taken the time and gone to the trouble to post worthless replies, poisoning the well, and willfully ignoring the real and deeper issues. Nothing new here. Hence my usage of the word insubstantial, which i thought was rather direct. When i say irrelevant i had hoped that the opportunity would arise for me to offer a proper and coherent deconstruction.

Now… the original question was if ‘we’ became veggie/vegan because of Paul.And i answered that question with what i thought was a bare minimum of fanfare and finger pointing.

Well, for instance myself… No absolutely not. I became vegetarian because I listened to explanations about things I did not know. And for instance the things Hari’s Chick writes here are the ones which made me veggie. Because of the way it is presented, just like the Yogis of the Himalayas have done it for centuries... in good harmony and without pressure.You are a veggie?! Well that is good news! We are more alike than you realize, perhaps it appears that i post things in a dangerous fashion or in some sort of fit of jealousy. I am the only vegan i know, for instance.

George never told anyone "you MUST read about the Eastern Philosphy".. he gave people books to read and he gave us "My Sweet Lord" which was so new to the Western World in 1970 and is so common now in music thanks to him. How many people were vegan in 1953 and how many are now and how does that come? Mouth to mouth conversations. (I don't want answers about the numbers btw LOL)Good questions you raise FPSHOT they certainly are not remote or difficult at all, in any sense of the word. The George point i was going to raise up in another way. The Beatles were if anything open minded and didn't really try to hide anything.

So my point is not about having two sides, or comparing it to other issues, but.. to explain that if you do not start a conversation about things, nothing changes, just like in the other issues I mentioned. I know but i was looking at the slippery slope aspect of some other statements here, made by others in a careless fashion. Agreeing to disagree just doesn't cut it for me, or in the real world. Again my opinion. I like looking at the other side of the coin.. to me it's part of being responsible and acting in an evenhanded and conscientious manner.

Had I not known what I learned, I would maybe still be what you and probably most of the people here were or are .. non-veggie/vegan.Excellent point not to be taken lightly. Guilty as charged... errr actually this bothers me alot. If not for my curious nature and access to the Internet, i doubt i would have ever picked up Silent Spring, The Mad Cowboy, Diet for a Small Planet or anything by Peter Singer.

Sure, I can forget the apples and oranges and write like you did and say “Eating meat is barbaric and cruel. A fact is a fact FPSHOT, you seem bent on just glossing over what has been lightly touched upon here. Once again that statement in particular wasn't directed at you, you shouldn't feel the need to offer up a vile defense and a parade of "snide" comments that would get us nowhere, real fast. In fact it was meant for someone else, who hasn't returned to the fray, and it's a statement that doesn't lie, or mislead and it was an honest statement, no hidden agenda, no mind games, meant in a sincere fashion... but somehow it becomes obvious to me that my suggestions would be routinely ignored or poo-pooed, not given proper consideration. What do you suggest that i do, just look the other way or pat somebody on the head who regularly chows down on the latest junk food concoction or doesn't know, or worse yet, doesn't even care what the inside of a slaughterhouse looks like? That is an obscene suggestion. Once again it's a both sides of the coin issue.
It doesn't matter how one was raised, it's just plain wrong and unhealthy.” I am so glad you have brought this very point up. I do have a little "country boy" in me. That is why i zeroed in on this rather hollow excuse to justify the mindless consumption of animal products. Now i know better.
If I am right you are vegetarian since about 1989, so before all that – unless it is your birthyear - maybe you fitted in your own description also about it’s environmental aspects and about thinking of animals? Actually 1989 was a very good year for me. Think Limp Bizkit my friend. Was that meant as an insult FPSHOT? That seems to me to be a rather unnecessary and inconsistent remark.. And it seems to me you are yourself falling victim to the notion that double-standards will somehow save the day and are necessary here. I thought that is exactly what this thread is not about. Anyway... Exactly. I lived a rather pathetic waste of a life before i became veggie, having been a victim of the SAD. As for my vegetarianism, I would be more than happy to give you a brief rundown here. I basically have been vegan for 5 1/2 years now, lacto-ovo for the approxmate 1 year previous to that and ate a mostly lacto-ovo with the occasional fish for 2 1/2 years previous to that. Finally i just got tired of it. I don’t mean this rude, but those remarks in conversations like this would never have even make me think of becoming a vegetarian. It probably would have turned me away from reading the thread. I'm sorry you feel that way, i do have my reasons. If nothing else i am being honest and not trying to avoid the issues at hand. And i am not afraid to trot my reasons and my justifications out for a public inspection.
So, something made you change and that is also for instance what Hari's Chick is trying to explain... sharing information... Yes. And that is precisely what i am doing, sharing information in the hopes that someone will see that i am committed to being veggie, and that this will not change anytime soon. Instead of offering witless rebuttals and provocative statements, would it be too much of a stretch for someone to say "i'll look into that" or "maybe i should practice the MeatOut Mondays thing" or "what harm could it do?" It's so easy being veggie, it's silly... i mean i don't know why it scares so many people, and what it is that prompts them into fits of anger and irresponsible reactions.

Unfortunately i live in the real world.

In closing let me quote John Lennon here, his remarks always touch my soul.
If everyone demanded peace instead of another television set, then there'd be peace.
Words to live by.

[kmac]

In my search for veggie information I found the VEGGIE GLOBAL (http://www.veggieglobal.com/features/veggieguide.htm) website, which seems to be a good source for information in transitioning to and maintaining a vegetarian lifestyle.

And this GoVeg (http://www.goveg.com/)website as well.

[FPSHOT]

A fact is a fact FPSHOT, you seem bent on just glossing over what has been lightly touched upon here. Once again that statement in particular wasn't directed at you, you shouldn't feel the need to offer up a vile defense and a parade of "snide" comments that would get us nowhere, real fast. In fact it was meant for someone else, who hasn't returned to the fray, and it's a statement that doesn't lie, or mislead and it was an honest statement, no hidden agenda, no mind games, meant in a sincere fashion...

oh I know it was not directed at me but that was not my issue and I am not defensive here.

Thanks for writing back. I waited a bit to reply to be sure you were finished editing :wink1:

but somehow it becomes obvious to me that my suggestions would be routinely ignored or poo-pooed, not given proper consideration. What do you suggest that i do, just look the other way or pat somebody on the head who regularly chows down on the latest junk food concoction or doesn't know, or worse yet, doesn't even care what the inside of a slaughterhouse looks like?

well I think that because of the way you respond with the 'definitions' like I quoted in my previous post, you did not get the feedback and attention you hoped for.

What I suggest? You know... I do not mean to tell you what to do but... this is an interesting thread and I just like things to go well also for those who just read all this. So just because I care about this subject I respond, but I am no leading party here. So what I suggest? Well since you ask; simply to change the atmosphere of your writing. But that is not up to me but purely a suggestion.

Was that meant as an insult FPSHOT? That seems to me to be a rather unnecessary and inconsistent remark.. And it seems to me you are yourself falling victim to the notion that double-standards will somehow save the day and are necessary here. I thought that is exactly what this thread is not about.

no it was not meant as an insult. What I mean is that now you are vegan you take a certain position whereas only a few years ago you were one who would have been talked to, the way you wrote to some people here. I am interested to have as many people as possible join this conversation. Yet it is my personal opinion that the 'cowboy' way of writing will not attract people.

would it be too much of a stretch for someone to say "i'll look into that" or "maybe i should practice the MeatOut Mondays thing" or "what harm could it do?" It's so easy being veggie, it's silly... i mean i don't know why it scares so many people, and what it is that prompts them into fits of anger and irresponsible reactions.


what scares 'so many people' is not the issues of being a veggie, but in this case here in my opinion it is the way you choose to write your beliefs. It would not make me 'look in to it' for even a second. We have had conversations like this many times here over the years and it always used to end because of the language used and how non-veggies would write how much they like to eat meat and then responses would be made in a similar way and only in my opinion, as much as I love a tough conversation when needed, on this subject here at Links it only made people walk away from the thread and that is just a great pity. It's better to keep the conversation going and still to have the actual issue on hand. At least, that is my opinion. But anyone is free to write what they like. Some things I would wanna write here at times would make me get banned LOL.

Maybe and again this is no insult, maybe just compare the way you try to make your point with the way Hari's Chick for instance does it and I am not promoting her here but the approach is entirely different and has made people listen and look in to it.

[FPSHOT]

In my search for veggie information I found the VEGGIE GLOBAL (http://www.veggieglobal.com/features/veggieguide.htm) website, which seems to be a good source for information in transitioning to and maintaining a vegetarian lifestyle.

And this GoVeg (http://www.goveg.com/)website as well.

Great sites...thanks for posting them.

[Hari's Chick]

Maybe and again this is no insult, maybe just compare the way you try to make your point with the way Hari's Chick for instance does it and I am not promoting her here but the approach is entirely different and has made people listen and look in to it.

That is very nice to say but I am sorry to say that I have felt in this thread like a total failure. Each time I posted, I failed to convey what was in my heart by being cowardly and soft. Each time I read iFrog's posts I felt possessed the courage I lacked.

If I were an animal being sent to slaughter, I would appreciate the urgency and honesty of iFrog's messages far more than the cowardice of my own.

That is why I gave up and posted pictures of Lord Krishna. I just pray seeing Him bestows mercy on those not inclined towards animal compassion. I just left it in His Divine Hands, mine feeling incapable.

Hare Krishna

[FPSHOT]

OK well sorry I spoke

[Hari's Chick]

I appreciate the vote of confidence, I just do not deserve it.

[FPSHOT]

I can only speak for myself but I prefer the way you tell people about it all these years now. Also on that I have based my personal opinions I gave IFrog

I believe there is a difference between how you feel inside about things like this and how you write it down. I did not see any cowardness in what you posted.

But I guess I was wrong, ok fine. It's just that in my opinion the way you have written over the years here has earned a lot of respect and even in this thread, just look at the responses also from people who are not vegetarians and see how conversations have grown over the years. I can understand that at times you feel like you want to shout it out, but is that the answer to get the message through?

Anyways, I have said what I wanted to say..now back to topic.

[FPSHOT]

I'm not a veggie, though I probably eat about 75% veggie meals, but as soon as somebody starts running towards me screaming "YOU EVIL HORRIBLE SLAUGHTERING HORRIBLE HORRRIBLE EVIL EVIL EVIL PERSON", that totally turns me off and makes me want to do the opposite of what they want me to do.

Perfectly said .... and here comes mister Comp(H)arrison again...this happens with so many issues in life...

Now let's get that percentage up

[kmac]

That is very nice to say but I am sorry to say that I have felt in this thread like a total failure. Each time I posted, I failed to convey what was in my heart by being cowardly and soft.

HC, I think your passion for the subject came through loud and clear. And, you made it perfectly clear how your deity viewed the subject as well.

There is nothing cowardice in being civil in an open forum, there is no sense in alienating others in order to effect change. The facts of an argument, when presented and applied skillfully, will achieve far more.

Peace.

[PepperlandFrog]

Thanks for writing back. I waited a bit to reply to be sure you were finished editing :wink1:Thank you FPSHOT i just want to make it clear that my intentions are honorable, i am not here to muddy the waters.
well I think that because of the way you respond with the 'definitions' like I quoted in my previous post, you did not get the feedback and attention you hoped for. Again at the risk of repeating myself, the "definition" game shouldn't be a one way street, a casual occurence, easily discounted, the end of the game. No one here lives in a one-way world, to the best of my knowledge. Think about the give and take thing that you mentioned. It is my belief that keeping it clean and keeping it simple will accomplish alot more in the long run. You just can't pick and choose your battles. It's wrong.
but... this is an interesting thread and I just like things to go well also for those who just read all this. So just because I care about this subject I respond, but I am no leading party here. I agree this is an interesting thread.
What I mean is that now you are vegan you take a certain position whereas only a few years ago you were one who would have been talked to, the way you wrote to some people here. I am interested to have as many people as possible join this conversation. Yet it is my personal opinion that the 'cowboy' way of writing will not attract people. Cowboy style?? I don't think so. But with one small difference. That is i would actually listen to what others would tell me, i seriously attempt to look at the deeper aspects. Hey...It causes no harm, doesn't leave a bad impression. And my interpretations are my own. But on balance i agree with your remarks.
what scares 'so many people' is not the issues of being a veggie, but in this case here in my opinion it is the way you choose to write your beliefs. Again doomed to become nothing more than a fading shadow in the real world of give and take, falsely interpreted and falsely applied. An apples and oranges thing once again. The words just don't magically fall off the page, that is nonsense. It would not make me 'look in to it' for even a second.Sad but true? Anyway...This i am starting to realize. Competent validation of ones beliefs here is the key. Look at it like this...A simple down to earth conversation about ones closely held beliefs, especially when it concerns how ones actions affects others, in this case sentient and peaceful beings, shouldn't automatically turn into a bear wrestling match. There is no way out. Some things I would wanna write here at times would make me get banned LOL. Welcome to the club.
...maybe just compare the way you try to make your point with the way Hari's Chick for instance does it and I am not promoting her here but the approach is entirely different and has made people listen and look in to it.Yes that is true i see your actual point. I will give that a second look, i have to admit i lose it quite often when doing actual conversations with people, disguised as outreach, and if nothing else i end up with a negative result. To me to be competent and being honest should be held in the highest regard. Otherwise people just won't believe what you have to say. That they refuse to understand is a different issue entirely, the major obstacle the causes the most consternation and also causes inobjectivity to flourish, and is best considered improper and useless.

[PepperlandFrog]

That is very nice to say but I am sorry to say that I have felt in this thread like a total failure. Each time I posted, I failed to convey what was in my heart by being cowardly and soft. Each time I read iFrog's posts I felt possessed the courage I lacked.

If I were an animal being sent to slaughter, I would appreciate the urgency and honesty of iFrog's messages far more than the cowardice of my own.

Hare KrishnaThank you for the show of support, i often feel at a disadvantage myself, like i'm causing moral failings to occur.

Also if i may add something here, i can see clearly the point that FPSHOT is making.

[Hari's Chick]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/AAMB4/aamsz=300x44_MULTILINK/4147483a6009.html

Carnivore sex off the menu
By REBECCA TODD - The Press | Tuesday, 31 July 2007

A new phenomenon in New Zealand is taking the idea of you are what you
eat to the extreme.

Vegansexuals are people who do not eat any meat or animal products, and
who choose not to be sexually intimate with non-vegan partners whose
bodies, they say, are made up of dead animals.

The co-director of the New Zealand Centre for Human and Animal Studies
at Canterbury University, Annie Potts, said she coined the term after
doing research on the lives of "cruelty-free consumers".

Cruelty-Free Consumption in New Zealand: A National Report on the
Perspectives and Experiences of Vegetarians and other Ethical Consumers
asked 157 people nationwide about everything from battery chickens to
sexual preferences.

Many female respondents described being attracted to people who ate
meat, but said they did not want to have sex with meat-eaters because
their bodies were made up of animal carcasses.

"It's a whole new thing - I have not come across it before," said
Potts.


One vegan respondent from Christchurch said: "I believe we are what we
consume, so I really struggle with bodily fluids, especially sexually."


Another Christchurch vegan said she found non-vegans attractive, but
would not want to be physically close to them.

"I would not want to be intimate with someone whose body is literally
made up from the bodies of others who have died for their sustenance,"
she said.

Christchurch vegan Nichola Kriek has been married to her vegan husband,
Hans, for nine years.

She would not describe herself as vegansexual, but said it would
definitely be a preference.

She could understand people not wanting to get too close to non-vegan
or
non-vegetarians.

"When you are vegan or vegetarian, you are very aware that when people
eat a meaty diet, they are kind of a graveyard for animals," she said.

[Hari's Chick]

Since the author of this thread has not been here in a while, I've moved this into Here There and Everywhere. Hopefully if she returns she will be able to locate it.

[cokate]

[QUOTE=kmac;726992]How long after converting before you no longer desired meat?

What foods helped in satisfying the desire to eat meat during the conversion period or was it just mind over matter that pushed you through?

QUOTE]

I've been veg for about 5 years, and my motives have moved around a lot. I started out because I saw the "meet your meat" video from Peta and for health reasons. Now, although I am still a supporter of animal rights, I'm really veg because it's healthy and I'm happy. Why change? :)

and to answer your questions, kmac...
I'd say about 2 or 3 years to completely stop wanting meat. Basically, as long as it takes you to forget the taste of it, although when I smell a hamburger on the grill..

CHOCOLATE. not really an equivalent substitute, but honestly. is there anything it doesn't cure? meat cravings are no different.

[PepperlandFrog]

Since the author of this thread has not been here in a while, I've moved this into Here There and Everywhere. Hopefully if she returns she will be able to locate it.Cool.

[PepperlandFrog]

How long after converting before you no longer desired meat?

What foods helped in satisfying the desire to eat meat during the conversion period or was it just mind over matter that pushed you through?Instantly lost the desire to eat meat, if you don't count the mostly bacon and then the pepperoni pizza dreams that started to occur over 18 months later, about 9 after becoming vegan. That's really true.
Anything that had beans and brown rice seemed to do the trick, only to discover the beauty of having potatoes with some toppings for dinner. But for me it was definitely a mind over matter thing, if it was veggie i would consume it, knowing that i could always have some soy milk or a peanutbutter and jelly sandwich to soothe me. Now i would recommend hummus, whole wheat bread, spaghetti noodles and of course salsa. We're talking bellyache here. You can't go wrong.

[PepperlandFrog]

I'd say about 2 or 3 years to completely stop wanting meat. Basically, as long as it takes you to forget the taste of it, although when I smell a hamburger on the grill.. Let me make a minor correction here... if i even think about eating something that is not veggie, i instantly become ill. That smell almost makes me want to throw up, happens alot.

[Hari's Chick]

Let me make a minor correction here... if i even think about eating something that is not veggie, i instantly become ill. That smell almost makes me want to throw up, happens alot.

me too!!

[kmac]

Thanks for the advice cokate and PFrog.:wave1:

[nightfishsnake]

i officially went vegetarian in '82,before then i experimented eating only
chicken and refused to touch any seafood.never cared for fish,mollusks
or crustaceans.funny thing is that i enjoy the ocean,but i get nauseated
from the smell of seafood,go figure!i didn't stop eating meat because of
Paul or any other musician,i did it for ethical reasons only.

[Loony_leo]

I would say I'm sort of trying to become Vegetarian. Since Canada Day (July 1st) I haven't touched any red meat at all. I just got sick of it, I've found it doesn't taste that great unless its got HP or Ketchup or someting like that on it. It can also be hard to chew, and its just so fatty. Plus I've found I just feel better without eating as much meat.

And I don't think I really did because of Paul... I'm just sick of meat....Veggies and Fruits have more flavour anyhow!

I do however still eat chicken and fish, but I'm trying to get away from that. But you know its hard to go purely Veggie when your parent's aren't purely veggie, (I am only 18 lol). But I'm gonna try and get only "free range chicken", but its hard to know which ones are free range. One day I do hope to cut down even more on the meat.

Plus its better for the environment. I think the statistic is 50 acres of grazing ground is used for one cow. And yeah, the big industries are quite disgusting with how they handle the food....

If anyone has any veggie recipes they'd like to share I'd be very thankful! Also if anyone has tofu cooking tips.

Anyone here tried Falafall? I love it its so delicious. Oh, and anyone in Canada...have you ever tried President's Choice Portobella Swiss Mushroom Patties?? They are such a delicious Veggie Patty!

[Hari's Chick]

I would say I'm sort of trying to become Vegetarian. Since Canada Day (July 1st) I haven't touched any red meat at all. I just got sick of it, I've found it doesn't taste that great unless its got HP or Ketchup or someting like that on it. It can also be hard to chew, and its just so fatty. Plus I've found I just feel better without eating as much meat.

And I don't think I really did because of Paul... I'm just sick of meat....Veggies and Fruits have more flavour anyhow!

I do however still eat chicken and fish, but I'm trying to get away from that. But you know its hard to go purely Veggie when your parent's aren't purely veggie, (I am only 18 lol). But I'm gonna try and get only "free range chicken", but its hard to know which ones are free range. One day I do hope to cut down even more on the meat.

Plus its better for the environment. I think the statistic is 50 acres of grazing ground is used for one cow. And yeah, the big industries are quite disgusting with how they handle the food....

If anyone has any veggie recipes they'd like to share I'd be very thankful! Also if anyone has tofu cooking tips.

Anyone here tried Falafall? I love it its so delicious. Oh, and anyone in Canada...have you ever tried President's Choice Portobella Swiss Mushroom Patties?? They are such a delicious Veggie Patty!

That's awesome, LLeo! Tofu is good so many ways. If you have not tried freezing it, give it a try sometime to use in a recipe. It will have a chewy texture and marinates well.

FPSHOT put some really good veggie recipes on the recipe thread, be sure to check those out!

Here is another which is good cold in summertime...


~Tailgate Picnic~

1 T olive oil
24 oz. tofu (frozen 24 hours, thawed)
2 cloves of garlic, minced
1 small sweet red pepper, chopped
1/2 cup chopped scallions
1 pkg frozen chopped spinach, thawed and squeezed dry
1/4 cup fresh basil
1 cup tofutti sour cream
2 'eggs' (egg replacer)
2 T soy milk
2 T grated soy parmesan cheese
2 t balsamic vinegar
1 T whole wheat pastry flour
2 refrigerated prepared uncooked pizza crust

In a large skillet, heat the oil. Add the thawed tofu and garlic; cook until browned...about 6-8 minutes. Transfer to a large bowl. Add peppers and scallions to the skillet. Cook until tender, about 3 or 4 minutes. Stir in the spinach and basil & cook another minute or so. Transfer to the bowl with the tofu. In a small bowl, combine sour cream, egg replacer, soy milk, parmesan and vinegar; set aside.

Coat a 9" springform pan with nonstick spray. On floured wax paper, roll out one of the pizza doughs. Place the rolled dough into the pan~ it should be about 1/8" thick. The dough should hang a little over the top of the pan.

Spoon half the tofu mix onto the dough. Next, add sour cream mixture, spreading to about 1/2" of the edge. Top with remaining tofu mixture.

Roll remaining dough into a cirle larger than the pan. Lay across top and fold the bottom and top together at edges, sealing it, and then making it look nice. Tuck and pinch. Prick the middle a few times with a fork.

Bake at 375 degrees until golden, about 55-60 minutes. Cool at least 10 mins on wire rack before unmolding. This is fantastic warm and even cold the next day for a picnic.

Serves 6

*** for the non garlic version~ 1/2 teaspoon asefotida can be used instead

[Hari's Chick]

Oh, lol, you have to cut the tofu into bite size pieces before cooking it... :laugh5:

[Esmirelda]

Hi,
I just found this thread. I'm a "nothing with a face" vegetarian.
I've been this way for about 20 years now. I never have had any cravings for meat. I have no interest in eating an animal. It goes against my personal beliefs.
Its awkward to go to other people's homes for a meal. I don't want them to be "put out" and feel like they have to make something special just for me. I don't want them to feel that they're offering to share their food with me is unappreciated (because I do appreciate it). Yet I can't just abandon my beliefs. So, I offer to bring a veggie dish to share.

[Loony_leo]

Thanks a million for the recipe Hari's Chick, it sounds delicious!!!!

[Hari's Chick]

I don't want them to be "put out" and feel like they have to make something special just for me. I don't want them to feel that they're offering to share their food with me is unappreciated (because I do appreciate it). Yet I can't just abandon my beliefs. So, I offer to bring a veggie dish to share.

That is very sweet. :smile1: Also then they can see how yummy veggie things can be!

[Hari's Chick]

Thanks a million for the recipe Hari's Chick, it sounds delicious!!!!


You're very welcome!!! :smile1:

[Hari's Chick]

Since McDonald's launched their massive "Name it Burger" campaign to name the new McDonald's burger, their website has been inundated with suggestions like 'Murder Burger', the 'Obese Burger', the 'Animal Abuse Burger', the 'McColonCancer Burger', and the 'McDeath.'

Sadly, it is unlikely that McDonald's will ever make these brilliant suggestions public. So in the interests of letting the public know what people really think the new McDonald's burger should be named, ALV has launched NameItMurder.com. If you want to let the world know what you really think of the new McDonald's burger, please visit the site and enter our Name it Murder competition (the competition ends in one week so get your entries in soon). Please also forward a link to nameitmurder.com ( http://www.alv.org.au/nameitmurder/home.htm ) to as many people as you can! While you're at it, feel free to visit the McDonald's site NameItBurger to directly let them know what you think of them.

[PepperlandFrog]

Since McDonald's launched their massive "Name it Burger" campaign to name the new McDonald's burger, their website has been inundated with suggestions like 'Murder Burger', the 'Obese Burger', the 'Animal Abuse Burger', the 'McColonCancer Burger', and the 'McDeath.'

Sadly, it is unlikely that McDonald's will ever make these brilliant suggestions public. No of course not. Excellent campaign, keep up the good work.